Tonight's The Night

[Khandro]

'Downing Street has confirmed Parliament is to be prorogued after the close of business tonight, with MPs to return on the 14th October for a Queen’s Speech.

The Queen’s original order allowed Boris to pick any time between today and the 12th. Hilariously, Bercow has to announce the prorogation order in Parliament, which he won’t be too pleased about'.

[fiction-factory]

Jim, given that MPs held numerous indicative votes on suggestions they put forward- and none of them were considered acceptable- it's hard to see how any further parliamentary debate will resolve it. We know that overall the HoC simply does not want to leave.

[douglas9401]

Suggestion acted upon Danny, fill yer boots:

"Treat others as you would like to be treated and respect other people’s opinions. Discussions can get passionate but users should moderate their language and refrain from personal attacks and profanity. We encourage lively debate but name calling, harassment or abuse will not be tolerated."

[Jackdaw33]

The office of Speaker was always a noble and honourable one,until that slimy little squit, Bercow, got his grubby little mitts on the job. Good riddance, and the sooner he goes the better.

[Old_Geezer]

Tonight's the night completely.
You give your GE verdict sweetly.
Tonight the light of distrust's in your eyes.
You'll still be prorogued tomorrow.

This a lasting treasure.
As well as a moment's pleasure.
Can I believe the magic of your sighs ?
You'll still be prorogued tomorrow.

[ichkeria]

Hands up who thinks Johnson’s strategy has worked so far? Worked for him, that is?
So far he has lost control of Parliament, lost control of Brexit, lost his majority in Parliament, lost the support of his brother, and succeeding in uniting the opposition and making Jeremy Corbyn look sensible.
You may rant and rave at the iniquities of Parliament, the speaker, the EU etc but it doesn’t alter the fact that he has seriously if not unpredictably messed up.
It’s quite a track record.
The tactics that worked to get him into Number Ten are not going to work if he wants to make a success of being PM: he has probably got two options: rewind and ditch Cummings and push hard to get a deal through parliament which might not be as impossible as it sounds.
Or perhaps hunker down and hope to win an election after Oct 31

[jim360]

FF: that is true, but there again, as long as the route of revoking Article 50 is simply not an option, then something else has to be. So there would have to be a consensus found somewhere.

It's also worth noting that the indicative votes only decided that no particular route had an absolute majority, ie when asked "should we do this or not this?", "not this" always won. But if you force the Commons to choose between two positive options then you would presumably see a different picture.

Bercow's legacy will perhaps be polarising, as JD confirms...

[Old_Geezer]

Personally I reckon he's done as well as could be expected in the circumstances, trying to uphold the referendum decision againg a sea of MPs wanting to hand all control over to the EU. And the "game's" still afoot.

[ichkeria]

Actually the proroguing of parliament is almost a side issue just now.
Parliament has done its business: the disappointing thing about it was the dishonesty from the government that this was not about Brexit when we all know it was and had been planned 12 days before it was announced.

[Old_Geezer]

Against

[fiction-factory]

> But if you force the Commons to choose between two positive options then you would presumably see a different picture.

The only options I'm aware of are accept the EUs' deal (which is the result of 3 years of negotiation) or leave with No Deal- both of which have been rejected.

I cannot see where another idea would come from

[ToraToraTora]

gromit; "Boris may win this battle, but his political future does not look good. He has created too many enemies. " - enemies? yes, enemies of the state too, Boris has got a lot of the public in his corner and in the end they count. Let's see what happens once the Quislings finally allow an election shall we.

[ToraToraTora]

JIm; "Yes, but isn't that what you want anyway? " - yes I'd settle for that.

[Gromit]

Tora,
Boris’ only lifeline is a General Election. Which is precisely why he won’t get one. Not tonight. Not in October. Not soon on his terms.

While the Opposition have a huge majority in Parliament, they are in control. They can out vote the Government. Stop anything they don’t like. Johnson is the lamest of lame ducks. It is not in their interest to help him, and more in their interest to prolong his agony.
There will eventually be a GeneralElection, but not at Johnson’s calling and definitely not at a time that suits him.

[Old_Geezer]

It's not in anyone's interest for the nation to have a 'lame duck' government.
In any case the 'lame duck' can still kick out.

[Gromit]

// Hilariously, Bercow has to announce the prorogation order in Parliament, which he won’t be too pleased about'. //

Hilariously, Bercow will be pleased with his days work. He had the last laugh.

[Gromit]

// the 'lame duck' can still kick out. //

Not without falling flat on its face.

[gulliver1]

When making a speech , why does Boris keep taking a pen out of his inside jacket pocket. take the top off and then put it back , have you ever noticed .

[gulliver1]

16.38 Gromit , you are spot on.

[cassa333]

Both May and Johnson tried but TBH there is now no middle ground.

The cabinet is split and the population are split three ways. Remain, leave with a deal at any cost and leave without a deal.

Remain is not an option.... if one remembers that far back remain had been discounted three years ago.

So leave with a bad deal or leave with no deal.

Anyone with an ounce of common sense and who isn’t an imbecile should know no deal is by far the better option. Because no deal gives one the option and opportunity to get on and make something out in the real and big world.

[david small]

Cassa333 you hit the button, an ounce of common sense. Not seen much of that for quite a time.