M Samoyed

[wiggal]

I posted a thread a while ago about rehoming our Samoyed.
We have since been making alot of changes and are now in the position to get him the training and so on that he needs and he will be staying with us.
Firstly, howndo i stop him digging up the garden?? We thought about giving him a sand area to dig in, but with having cats, it will turn intoa giant cat loo!

Also we have problems with him on the lead, he pulls and we cant let him off the lead as he runs off and ignores us. I can imagine it being easy to train him to not pull & come back, apart from the fact he wont ea ny treats when out on walks!
He does at home, but when out, he will sit and if i try to give him a treat, he turns his head away from me & refuses!!

Help please :)

[jules77]

We gave up stopping the dogs from digging up the lawn and took the lawn up, it looked like a race track anyway - we now have a beautiful garden with raised flower beds, wonderful shrubs, and.......slabs!! How old is the dog, what type of collar do you have him on? I would strongly suggest you find a local dog training club, and be prepared for a lot of patience. I have also heard the book by Jan Fennell to be excellent if you are prepared to follow it.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dog-Listener-Jan-Fenne ll/dp/0006532365/ref=pd_bowtega_2/203-6838503- 2471163?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1178825515&sr=1-2

[wiggal]

Hi Jules,

I have said to my partner getting him to stop digging is pretty much not going to happen! He has said it is ok if we can contain it to one area, which is fair enough, as we rent the house we are in, and want to keep it in good condition!
He is 3 years old, and we use one of the 'rogz' collars on him along with a halti. But he still drags me along!
I will be taking him to training and looking at getting a trainer to come to the house, but the problem with taking him to training is he goesmad around other dogs!
He gets so excited when he sees them that he either tries to have his way with them (we are getting him neutered next month) and he has broken many haltis by going hyper, jumping on his back legs, squeaking and all that! So im guessing you can understand, taking him to a training group would be hell!

[jules77]

Never heard of a rogz collar - I have always found a leather half check to be the best - but there is a knack to stopping a dog from pulling and as I said absolutely loads of patience. Basically you walk forward, if he pulls you stop, then try again and each time he pulls you stop and tell him no with a little yank on the collar. Keep the lead in your right hand, and the dog on the left hand side of you, and when you give a little yank on the lead do it with your left hand. As for him going mad at dog training, try spraying him with a water sprayer. I use an old jif lemon squeezer as it is handy to keep in my pocket. I have a bitch who is hyper a dog shows as she gets soooooo excited and have found giving her some herbal scullcap and valerian tablets really calm her down before a show .http://www.dorwest.com/new_pop_ups/scullcap_va lerian_taps_vet.htm and if she is super excited I use some 'show off' while I am there (didnt hear a murmour out of her at crufts and I was dreading it) http://www.fitandfertile.com/products.htm. I would give the book a go, it is only just over �6 and worked for my sons dog who was a rescue and pulled him all the way up the road. I know dog training may seem like hell, but that is what he is going for, and they will show you how to handle him. good luck !

[jules77]

just looked at the rogz collars, basically are they a nylon slip lead? if so, dont think they are strong enough - try a leather half check collar - (third one down at Glenwood) - they will make them to any size and width and they will last the lifetime of your dog so worth the money - I am still using one I bought 16 years ago - http://www.collienet.com/GLENWOOD/main1.htm
or
http://www.accoladeleathercraft.com/erol.html# 99X0

[wiggal]

We have never had a problem with the collar breaking Jules, its justhis halti that he breaks!
I dont want to put any kind of collar with a chain on him as it catches on his fur and pulls it, and that causes him more stress then anything, and i dont think that is fair on him :(

[drofsereb]

Digging in the garden is a breed feature I'm afraid, ours grew out of it... Running off when off the lead is also a breed feature - they are meant to run all day remember, herding/puling loads etc. A good trainer will be able to stop it pulling very quickly though.
They are also very sociable animals (both with humans and other dogs) so do get excited about ther dogs they meet. You've bought a Samoyed - live with some of the traits, but the pulling can be stopped quickly and painlessly by a good trainer.

[jules77]

wiggal - a good half check collar will not pull his fur, I have rough collies who have the same amount, if not more fur round their neck than samoyeds. Donk think you will ever have any success with a nylon slip lead. With a half check if the dog pulls the collar tightens round the neck, then when they are on a loose lead the collar loosens so they learn to walk on a loose lead - no pain, no gain.

[eyeshade]

W our sharpei used to do the same thing, turn away, took no treats and ran off. We actually took him to a one-one trainer and made us start again with him. He thinks he is in charge at the moment and you have to stop that. Feed him after you have eaten and make sure he sees that and give him a tit bit after you have finished. Do not let him upstairs at all. He will see you in a higher position and its all about territory etc. When you go out, you must keep on opening and shutting the door ensuring that when he charges out through the door, you then slam it shut again and we did this for about 4 hours until he finally sat on the floor until we went out the door and we did this for about a week. The dog will totally change! Believe me it works, then you have to tackle the outside. Our beast seem to change instantly and as Jules said we took a water spray with us, (he hated water) and when he looked a bit feisty with another dog or lunged forward he got a spray of water. Hoorah! When we let him off the lead eventually, he knew who was in charge and he was a pleasure to walk but turn round and walk the other way and call him if you think he is going off too far and we will come back. You have to keep practicing all this together as a family and the rewards are remarkable. Good Luck. ES

[wiggal]

Im happy to life with the traits, it is my partner who is not!
Well, the digging is ok, but when he runs off and doesnt come back, it means he cant be let off at all so doesnt get the proper run around like he should, so that is a trait i dont so much like!

[jules77]

wiggal - you need to take the advice we have given you A) take him to dog training B) become the master so he is no longer in control (having him neutered may help and C) get a different type of collar, I can assure you a check collar is not cruel else I wouldnt use them

[winny]

Eyeshade advice is good see this website, read the books and watck the dvds. Jules is right too http://www.janfennellthedoglistener.com/
Try this site. We have used this method and had a visit from an assocciate and with hard work and persistance it works.

[wiggal]

Hi Jules,

I will take your advice,
He is not the master at all in the house, he does not go upstairs, never has, and when one of us is in the kitchen and he is out of the front room he sits patiently at the kitchen door just watching and waiting for us, he never enters the kitchen.
The only time he comes on the sofa is when he is askd, well it was, atleast until the last week or so when he invites himself up as soon as my partner gets up, but we tell him no straight away and he jumps straight back down and sits by my feet.
I was wondering, i bought a clicker, havent started using it yet or training him with it, but would that work when outside instead of trying to give him treats which he wont take? If we train him with it in the house and garden, will he still be the same with it on walks?

Thanks

[kita1]

Check this out, it is about clicker training out on walks etc.

http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2002b /whenclick.htm

also:

http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/index .htm

gives a full list of articles about clicker training etc.

this is an article about dominance and 'pack' leadership.

http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2004/ Debunking.pdf

[wiggal]

Ta Kita :)

He does the jumping up, and not coming back when called, (normally because he is too far away to hear us!)
I will have to take him to training classes on my own, as my partner gets very frustrated with him and annoyed with him when he is disobedient, so that is my task! Im worried i wont be able to control him on my own when he starts dragging my around to see other dogs!

[kita1]

Not being funny here, but it is your partner who has the problems with the dog and it is him who should be taking the dog to classes.

Classes tend to teach the owners more than the dog and from what you say your partner needs to build a relationship with the dog more so than you.

If you are going to keep the dog then your partner needs to get on with him, a good trainer will work with your partner and show him how to have a living/working relationship with the dog.

I don't honestly see the point in you taking the dog to the classes on your own, most of your problems can be cured easily, if you read the articles I gave they will help you. If you decide to go to a training class go by yourself first and observe the class, if you don't like the training (check chains, physical force etc.) then don't take your dog. Some classes may make your dog worse and you will end up feeling bad and will end up going down the road of rehoming the dog again.

A good site for dog training advice is: http://ttlntl.co.uk they have a forum you can join and get good advice from professional dog trainers/behaviourists, many have worked with rescue dogs of all different breeds. They also may be able to help you find a good trainer in your area.

Your main problem is your partner not getting on with the dog, unless you improve their relationship I think you will always have problems with the dog.

[jules77]

I also found a site that offers one to one on line training advice from a professional trainer - http://www.allbreedsgrooming.co.uk/training.ht m

[wiggal]

Kita,

I didnt mean that my partner as much has problems with the dog, he loves him very much.
The dog listens to my partner and does everything my partner says, he also never pulls on the lead when my partner is walking him, it is mainly me who has the problem controlling him as when he was a pup i was always the soft one, if my partner told him to do something he would run to me and ask for attention, and yes, i was too soft by far and gave it to him!
My partner thinks it would partly be beneficial for me to take him so i can gain control and he can see me as leader of the pack, as he already sees my partner as leader.