Welsh joke/story wanted in Welsh

[magistra]

Recently I came across the story of God justifying Himself to Gabriel as He creates Wales, culminating in "wait till you see the neighbours I've given them". I can't find a version that's actually in Welsh, though.

[Hopkirk]

Not the answer, but a good excuse to see this again.

http://www.flickr.com...ohnbullas/3003765860/

[mike11111]

If you can give the full joke in English I'll have a go at translating it. Not too long, though!

[MarkRae]

It might not surprise you to learn that there's a virtually identical joke told by Gaels... :-)

[wolf63]

Is there a common element to the Welsh joke and the Scottish Joke?

[magistra]

In the beginning the Lord God Almighty turned to the Archangel
Gabriel, and said:

"Today I am going to create a beautiful part of the Earth and I will
call it Wales. I will make a country of breathtaking blue lakes, rich
green forests and dark beautiful mountains from which from time to
time will be snow-covered. I will give it clear, swift rivers that will
overflow with salmon and trout.

The land shall be lush and fertile on which the people can raise cattle
and grow their food, as well as being rich with precious metals and
stones that will be sought after, the World over.

Underneath the land I shall lay rich seams of coal for the inhabitants to
mine. Around the coast I will make some of the most beautiful areas in
the World. White sandy beaches and cliffs that will attract all manner
of wildlife, and lots of islands that will be paradise to all who visit
them. In the waters around the shores there will be abundance of sea-life.

The people who will live there will be called the Welsh, and they will
be the friendliest people on my Earth. They will have magic in their
blood, and songs in their souls. Their Voices when raised in song shall
challenge the choir of angels."

"Excuse me, sire" interrupted the Archangel Gabriel, "don't you think
that you are being a bit generous to these Welsh?"

The lord just smiled and replied "You have not seen the neighbours
I'm giving them!"

[mike11111]

I'll work on it but it might be a day or so before I get back to you. Although I can read and write Welsh it is not my first language.

[magistra]

Thanks Mike 11111. I'm learning Welsh, but i don't think it's good enough for that.

[mike11111]

Here goes:
This is not a word for word translation butI have preserved the sense of everything.

My apologies in advance to fluent Welsh speakers for any mistakes and hope they will forgive a poor "Sais" who is merely a "dysgwr yr iaith Gymraeg".

Ar y dechrau trododd Yr Arglwydd Duw Hollalluog i'r Archangel Gabriel a dweud:

"Heddiw bydda i'n creu rhan brydferth y ddaear, a bydda i'n ei galw Cymru. Bydda i'n gwneud gwlad llynoedd y n syn las, fforestydd cyfoethog gwyrdd, a mynynoedd tywyll prydferth a fyddan nwh'n cael eu gorchuddio ag eira o bryd i'w gilydd. Bydda i'n rhoi iddi afonydd eglur cyflym a fyddan nwh'n cael eu llenwi gyda eog a brithyll.

Bydd y ddaear gyfoethog a ffrwythlon, lle bydd y pobol yn codi gwartheg a'u bwyd. Bydd hi'n ogystal cyfoeth gyda metelloed a meini gwerthfawr fyddan nhw'n cael eu chwlio ledled y byd.

Tan y ddaear bydda i'n gosod seldremau cyfoethog glo i'w gloddio. O amgylch yr afordir bydda i'n gwneud rhai ardaloedd harddaf yn y byd. Traethau gwynion tywodlyd a chlogwyni fyddan nhw'n tynnu holl fath o fywyd gwyllt, a llawer o ynysoedd fyddan nhw'n baradwys i'r holl fyddan nhw'n ymweld â nhw. Yn y dyfroedd o amgylch bydd helaethrwydd bywyd y môr. Bydd y pobol fydd yn byw fan 'na'n cael ei galw Y Cymry, a byddan nhw y pobl mwyaf cyfeillgar ar fy naear. Bydd hud yn eu gwaed a chaneuon yn eu eneidiau. Bydd ei lleisiau, pan maen nhw'n cael eu codi mewn caneuon, yn herio côr yr engyl."

"Esgusodwch fi, Arglwydd", torrodd ar drwas yr Archangel Gabriel, "dych chi ddim yn meddwl eich bod chi'n rhy hael i'r Cymry hyn?"

Gwennod Yr Arglwydd ac ateb, "Dych chi ddim wedi gweld y cymdogion rodda i iddyn nhw!"

[mike11111]

" llynoedd y n syn las" y n should read yn
" cael eu chwlio ledled y byd" chwlio should read chwilio
"ar drwas" should read ar draws

[DTCwordfan]

Got to give him a best answer for that, magistra.....

Mae'n rhaid i chi roi iddo ateb gorau ar gyfer hynny, magistra .....

[DTCwordfan]

The joke works in Australia - New Zealand
Sweden - Norway
Belgium - Holland
Texas - Louisiana
Ireland

[mike11111]

Just seen another typo, "mynynoedd " should read mynyddoed. As the spellchecker doesn't understand Welsh nearly everything I type is underlined in red so sometimes it's difficult to see the wood for the trees.

[MarkRae]

It never ceases to amaze me how two groups of languages, Brythonic and Goidelic can be so closely related yet so completely mutually unintelligible!

[mike11111]

Unlike Gaelic, Welsh is a phonetic language, so is easier to learn in that respect when you don't have a teacher.

[mike11111]

Here it is again with corrections to typos:
Ar y dechrau trododd Yr Arglwydd Duw Hollalluog i'r Archangel Gabriel a dweud:

"Heddiw bydda i'n creu rhan brydferth y ddaear, a bydda i'n ei galw Cymru. Bydda i'n gwneud gwlad llynoedd yn syn las, fforestydd cyfoethog gwyrdd, a mynyddoedd tywyll prydferth fyddan nwh'n cael eu gorchuddio ag eira o bryd i'w gilydd. Bydda i'n rhoi iddi afonydd eglur cyflym fyddan nwh'n cael eu llenwi gyda eog a brithyll.

Bydd y ddaear gyfoethog a ffrwythlon, lle bydd y pobol yn codi gwartheg a'u bwyd. Bydd hi'n ogystal cyfoeth gyda metelloed a meini gwerthfawr fyddan nhw'n cael eu chwilio ledled y byd.

Tan y ddaear bydda i'n gosod seldremau cyfoethog glo i'w gloddio. O amgylch yr afordir bydda i'n gwneud rhai ardaloedd harddaf yn y byd. Traethau gwynion tywodlyd a chlogwyni fyddan nhw'n tynnu holl fath o fywyd gwyllt, a llawer o ynysoedd fyddan nhw'n baradwys i'r holl fyddan nhw'n ymweld â nhw. Yn y dyfroedd o amgylch y glannau bydd helaethrwydd bywyd y môr. Bydd y pobol fydd yn byw fan 'na'n cael ei galw Y Cymry, a byddan nhw'r pobl mwyaf cyfeillgar ar fy naear. Bydd hud yn eu gwaed a chaneuon yn eu heneidiau. Bydd eu lleisiau, pan maen nhw'n cael eu codi mewn caneuon, yn herio côr yr engyl."

"Esgusodwch fi, Arglwydd", torrodd ar draws yr Archangel Gabriel, "dych chi ddim yn meddwl eich bod chi'n rhy hael i'r Cymry hyn?"

Gwennodd Yr Arglwydd ac ateb, "Dych chi ddim wedi gweld y cymdogion rodda i iddyn nhw!"

[MarkRae]

> Unlike Gaelic, Welsh is a phonetic language

Gaelic is almost 100% phonetic - you just need to learn the pronunciation rules...

[heathfield]

Agree with Mark - Gaelic is phonetic, and, given the restrictions of the Roman alphabet, the original writers did an amazing job of accurately recording complex vocal sounds. They did this by inserting letters that aren't pronounced, but act as modifiers to letters next to them. Unfortunately, this makes learning written Gaelic hugely difficult. It's frustrating to see a word ending perhaps with a group of five letters to be told that these are actually kept silent, and are there to show the pronunciation of preceding letters! All part of the rules Mark mentions!

[magistra]

Thank you so much, mike11111. I'll present it at my next Welsh class and acknowledge all the hard work that you put in.

[mike11111]

Before you do that, magistra, I have found further errors. In line 1 "trododd should read "troddodd". Also the word pobol (pobl), whenever it appears, should read bobol (bobl) as it is a feminine singular noun which mutates after the definite article, as it does throughout my translation.

i am also unhappy about my constant use of "fyddan nhw" where I think that perhaps "fyddan" on its own would suffice.

Any feedback you get would be most welcome. I took up learning Welsh a couple of years ago but the only assistance I have is two basic textbooks; Teach Yourself Welsh (which is rubbish and worse than useless to the serious student) and Colloquial Welsh by Gareth King, which is of much more use (though a bit too colloquial at times). Without a teacher or a Welsh-speaking society I tend to struggle, though I feel I haven't done too badly so far.

here is my final version (for now):

Ar y dechrau troddodd Yr Arglwydd Duw Hollalluog i'r Archangel Gabriel a dweud:

"Heddiw bydda i'n creu rhan brydferth y ddaear, a bydda i'n ei galw Cymru. Bydda i'n gwneud gwlad llynoedd yn syn las, fforestydd cyfoethog gwyrdd, a mynyddoedd tywyll prydferth fyddan (nhw)'n cael eu gorchuddio ag eira o bryd i'w gilydd. Bydda i'n rhoi iddi afonydd eglur cyflym fyddan (nhw)'n cael eu llenwi gyda eog a brithyll.

Bydd y ddaear gyfoethog a ffrwythlon, lle bydd y bobol yn codi gwartheg a'u bwyd. Bydd hi'n ogystal cyfoeth gyda metelloed a meini (cerrig?) gwerthfawr fyddan (nhw)'n cael eu chwilio ledled y byd.

Tan y ddaear bydda i'n gosod seldremau cyfoethog glo i'w gloddio. O amgylch yr afordir bydda i'n gwneud rhai ardaloedd harddaf yn y byd. Traethau gwynion tywodlyd a chlogwyni fyddan (nhw)'n tynnu pob math o fywyd gwyllt, a llawer o ynysoedd fyddan (nhw)'n baradwys i'r holl fyddan (nhw)'n ymweld â nhw. Yn y dyfroedd o amgylch y glannau bydd helaethrwydd bywyd y môr. Bydd y bobol fydd yn byw fan 'na'n cael ei galw Y Cymry, a byddan (nhw)'r bobl mwyaf cyfeillgar ar fy naear. Bydd hud yn eu gwaed a chaneuon yn eu heneidiau. Bydd eu lleisiau, pan maen nhw'n cael eu codi mewn caneuon, yn herio côr yr engyl."

"Esgusodwch fi, Arglwydd", torrodd ar draws yr Archangel Gabriel, "dych chi ddim yn meddwl eich bod chi'n rhy hael i'r Cymry hyn?"

Gwennodd Yr Arglwydd ac ateb, "Dych chi ddim wedi gweld y cymdogion rodda i iddyn nhw!"

[magistra]

I think your mastery of the language is superb, Mike1111. I've been going to weekly classes for 4 years now, and am nowhere near your level. Have you tried the online Say Something In Welsh (SSIW) course. I find that excellent for listening and speaking practice. There are some words I can't find in my dictionary, though : bobol (pobl/bobl?),ogystal, ledled, seldremau.