Listener 4497: 'catechism' By Tnap

[Encota]

The clue-solving was tough work in places and I spent an age somewhat baffled ... but a nice couple of PDMs brought it all to an enjoyable conclusion. Thanks tnap :-)

[Hagen]

Phew! That was one heck of a struggle, which didn't get any easier despite guessing the basis of the theme quite early on. I still haven't the faintest idea how the wordplay works for 15 across. Nice not to have a fiddly endgame but I found this rather too much on the frustrating side of tough - which of course reflects my incompetence as a solver rather than any fault of the setter!

[kdgs2]

I'm still nowhere near finished this, but I have to doff my cap to tnap for 29d!

[BobHWW]

This was hard indeed. I'm happy with the completed grid but 3 across clues I haven't managed to parse yet. Thanks for a good work-out tnap.

[sunny-dave]

My - that was hard - but scrupulously fair and a very novel way of using the theme.

Thanks tnap - my grey matter has been well and truly exercised and I shall now enjoy a relatively large drink.

[Philoctetes]

Very tough (first and second passes revealed no inroads), and I was expecting something else that was "confirmed" early on. No idea really what was going on, but satisfied.

[Scorpius]

This was battle right to the last entry. Like Philoctetes, I don't really understand what's going on with the eight entries suffering thematic effects. The others make sense. For a long time I didn't have the faintest inkling of the theme, but I was fortunate that guesses at corrections to two clues in the early batch enabled me to see a possible first word, since after that I had very few continuous strings of letters. I had one error but Google's auto-correct gave me the right word and the whole quotation. Even then, solving the remaining clues was no easy stroll.

Some of the misprints were very clever, and very hard to spot.

Until now I'd considered Elgin's puzzle to be the toughest of the year so far (ignoring the numerical). This was one rung higher up the ladder for me.

[HappyUncle]

I think I may have to give this one up, with around three-quarters of the grid filled. As Scorpius says, the treatment of the four is easily justified (once you've solved the clues or otherwise guessed what the answers must be), but for those of the others I've worked out, the rationale for what I've done eludes me.

The quotation, in ODQ but not in ODQ, would never have come to me if my education had followed a different path, but it still ain't helping. Not Angry, mind you, as this is (probably) an entirely fair puzle.

[olichant]

I thought this was tough, and excellent.

[olichant]

I should add, I thought one or two clues were a little forced - but that is difficult to avoid where there are misprints in all clues. Others were very good. There is still one that I can’t resolve, but hopefully I’ll get there.

[emcee]

This is the toughest of the year by a long chalk. I have about 2/3 of the grid completed and no idea of the theme.

I suspect the extra letters produce something I never studied at school!

Will report back if I ever complete it.

[Cruncher]

A couple of clues to go, and unclear as to the precise rationale for the thematic "effects", but otherwise enjoying the tussle with much encouragement derived from locating the quotation

[emcee]

All done now; my, that was TOUGH.

Some extremely difficult clues which make Sabre's clues seem a breeze!

It all came together very neatly but I, too, couldn't understand the rationale behind the treatment of the eight answers (the other four 'specials' were clear enough). I suspect it is due to me not possessing the specialized knowledge which may be needed to fully appreciate the thematic treatment. I certainly don't remember such in my degree days -- but that was a long time ago!

Well done to tnap on making it such a tough puzzle.

I can breathe a sigh of relief now...

[Cruncher]

Did anyone else try applying thematic treatment to the title? Curious answer

[perseverer]

Would be surprised if it was just a coincidence!

[icynorth]

I’m sure this is a very clever puzzle, but I’m surely missing something in the journey between title, quotation and theme. Maybe it will all become clear, but thanks tnap for the challenge. Let’s call it a draw. :-)