Fpellmafter

[xyzzy@bok]

Our language is a changing language, and not for lexical Luddites, what you think you are protecting has been in flux for centuries. If the majority say it's 'color' then 'colour' is not so useful in a search engine.. defunct by default; suggest you get with the program. Does anyone agree that it's better to go with the flow of change than to try to obstruct progress?

[smorodina]

It can be difficult to embrace change, especially when it goes against what you have always been taught, but we just have to accept that language will contine to change. In less than a generation the generally accepted pronuncation of the name for the letter 'h' seems to have changed from 'aitch' to 'haitch' and, while this was considered the height of illiteracy a couple of decades ago, it is now heard from well educated young people. I think the main beef of the self-appointed guardians of language is that change permeates up from the bottom and they have no control over it. What they consider to be 'vulgar' English goes on to be normal usage eventually and that really annoys them. This is why they spend so much time trying to fossilize 'their' form of English and denigrate the slang and 'street talk' some of which will be tomorrow's 'standard' English.

[smorodina]

And I agree with you about spelling, but I already droned on about that somewhere else...

[football]

The mobile phones & net are changing language the most. With smileys & emoticons & text messaging.

[LeMarchand]

Surely the reason for standardised spellings is to improve communication? If everyone uses the same spelling (and definitions), then there can be no doubt as to what the author means. We all make errors and/or typos but, to me, consistently poor use of spelling and grammar suggest someone who can't be bothered to take the effort to communicate his/her ideas properly. For example, on a forum that I belong to one member has spelling so poor that most of us cannot understand his posts. Yes, language evolves, but that seems a poor excuse for not having enough respect for your readers to make the effort to use correct spelling and grammar. By the way, everyone who has contributed to this thread (everyone so far has seemed to be of the opinion that poor spelling is not of concern) has taken the time to ensure that their posts have been spelled correctly.

[smorodina]

I think LeMarchand has slightly missed the point. The argument is not that we should not care about spelling, but that we should not try to impede any progress towards a simplification. It is precisely because most of the contributors to this debate are fairly skilled in the use of the language that they can see how it is the hurdle of spelling that, in fact, interrupts the flow of ideas and communication. The problem with Spellmaster is that he seems to equate maintaining some kind of 'pure' form of British English with an imagined cultural superiority. A rudimentary knowledge of the history of English will reveal that many of the supposed 'Americanisms' are, in fact, forms of British English that have died out in Britain whilst remaining standard in America. 'Gotten' is just one example ' common in Shakespeare's time.

[answerbok]

correct smorodina; in fact 'colour' used to be spelled color until the aristocracy got all posh and 'frenchified'. http://www.americansc.org.uk/Online/berube.htm and http://www.putlearningfirst.com/language/02signs/s
pell.html

[Spellmaster]

The increasing domination of world culture by a single nation is not healthy. I am not opposed to change,m as anyone wo has bothered to read my statements properly will see, but I will fight as long as there is breath in my body against the destruction or takeover of cultures by American cultural imperialism. If you cannot see what is happening around you, that is your problem.

[Spellmaster]

And "better to go with the flow of change"? So when Germany was changing from democracy to Nazism, it was good to "go with the flow of change" was it? Start thinking will you, instead of being a mindless robot.

[andy hughes]

Let's simplify this shall we? Everyone on this Site, with the exceptionf Spellmaster, rubs along tolerating opinions, diverse thought, and lapses in perceived spelling and gramar, for what ever reason. Spellmaster sees his role as that of harbinger of doom with regard to creeping Americanisation - a view to which is is entitled. What he is not entitled to do is to insult the intelligence of anyone Visitor who'se views conflct with his own. His response in his last post managed the difficult task of being over-reactive, incorrect, and offensive - which is some going in four lines! Spellmaster - no-one really cares if American culture is absorbed with ours - learn to live with it.

[Spellmaster]

Andy, you might not care but a lot of others do, very much. And, following your own advice elsewhere, if you don't like my postings, don't read them. Some of the postings here and elsewhere demonstrate the sloppy thinking by many people on this subject. Let's be clear, I positively welcome and embrace change; I love many of the changes brought by immigrants, and I agree entirely that language is always evolving. But what we are currently witnessing is not the normal process of evolution, nor is it to do with 'standardisation'. It is all to do with Americanisation. I know young people who say they don't like Americanisms but use them because they don't even know they are American, so all-pervasiveis US culture. Moreover, there is no mass debate or desire for standardisation; quite simply, the changes of spelling are part of the onslaught of American culture on the rest of the world. I, for one, welcome diversity, and I believe the Americanisation of culture aroung the globe is unhealthy and will destroy much of our current rich diversity. And to say, as some have here, that standardisation will remove barriers to communication is nonsense. You imply that Brits spelling programme instead of program gets in the way of effective communication - what utter twaddle. Following that argument to its logical conclusion, you should tell all people to stop speaking their native language and speak only American English. I am sure the French, Africans, the Chinese, etc will love you for that. Moreover, it isn't just spelling that is rapidly changing - it's pronunciation, dress, what we eat, how we behave. In these and other respects we are rapidly being Americanised; people in the UK complain about losing their culture to the EU, but are happy/blind to it being swamped by American cultural imperialism. Well I will fight this until I die, and people like andy hughes just make me all the more determined to fight against the lazy, sloppy thinking of people like him.

[Spellmaster]

First of all, thank you for the stars xyzzy. You might disagree with what I say, but at least you have had the courtesy to read what I said, rather than attack me for things that were the complete opposite of what I said, as some others have done! I also just wanted to add one final comment, which I forgot to put in my previous answer, and that is this: whilst change is frequently good, and often necessary, accepting change simply because it is change is merely crass. Just because something is a change from current/established practice, it does not follow that it is autmatically better. Sometimes change is not right or is unneccessary, and should be resisted. Let's accept change for the better, but not change for change's sake. Now I will leave this thread in peace.