ChatterBank1 min ago
Making the Law more Accessible
I’ve just had a long conversation with a colleague, and both of us feel that the law is not accessible to “the man in the street”. This got us to thinking about how we could make it more accessible.
I’m interested in people’s views. For example, there are sites such as this where people ask questions – sometimes they get a definitive answer which is great (hey, free advice is fantastic!). Sometimes their cases are a little too complicated for anything other than a general view and very often the advice is “See a solicitor”. There are other general information websites out there, which give lots of information, but it is not “case specific”.
I think it comes down to “cost”. If you look at the traditional lawyer’s firm, they have considerable overheads. Consequently, the hourly rate has to cover all those overheads and make a profit.
Now increasing Legal Aid isn't an option (it's going to be cut further in time), so isn't it up to the legal profession to make sure that legal advice is not just the prerogative of the rich?
So how do we reduce these costs? Well once answer is a “virtual law” service – ie online – using skype and telephones when necessary. However, what occurred to us is that this would not necessarily work because of a perceived lack of credibility.
I’m probably opening a massive can of worms here, but I’m interested to hear how people feel that getting the right advice could become more accessible.
I’m interested in people’s views. For example, there are sites such as this where people ask questions – sometimes they get a definitive answer which is great (hey, free advice is fantastic!). Sometimes their cases are a little too complicated for anything other than a general view and very often the advice is “See a solicitor”. There are other general information websites out there, which give lots of information, but it is not “case specific”.
I think it comes down to “cost”. If you look at the traditional lawyer’s firm, they have considerable overheads. Consequently, the hourly rate has to cover all those overheads and make a profit.
Now increasing Legal Aid isn't an option (it's going to be cut further in time), so isn't it up to the legal profession to make sure that legal advice is not just the prerogative of the rich?
So how do we reduce these costs? Well once answer is a “virtual law” service – ie online – using skype and telephones when necessary. However, what occurred to us is that this would not necessarily work because of a perceived lack of credibility.
I’m probably opening a massive can of worms here, but I’m interested to hear how people feel that getting the right advice could become more accessible.
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Yes there are places where you can get a certain level of free advice, but as you say, they are under enormous pressure. Also, for anything relatively specialist, they often can't help.
The legal access part of insurance policies is a good idea - although what is covered under some policies would need to be expanded since many policies exclude certain claims.
The legal access part of insurance policies is a good idea - although what is covered under some policies would need to be expanded since many policies exclude certain claims.
I was trying to be polite, Jack. There are some websites out there that are clearly run by utter shysters and I wouldn't trust them as far as I could kick them. (Although the same could be said, I suppose, for some law firms).
Part of our discussion centred around the credibility of going into a High Street firm which has existed for 120 years, sitting around an oak table, surrounded by law books. But that is how the costs start racking up.
Part of our discussion centred around the credibility of going into a High Street firm which has existed for 120 years, sitting around an oak table, surrounded by law books. But that is how the costs start racking up.
I believe that results speak for themselves.......and positive experiences (even if the outcome has gone 'against', so to speak) will do much to persuade future clients of the worth of any scheme.
Perhaps an initial visit (like the green form scheme) at home, or to the offices of a 'partnership-practice' (somewhere 'respectable') would allay concerns?
Perhaps an initial visit (like the green form scheme) at home, or to the offices of a 'partnership-practice' (somewhere 'respectable') would allay concerns?
Would it be feasible for the neighbourhood solicitor to offer some sort of membership scheme whereby you pay a fixed fee monthly that guarantees a certain level of service. Maybe it would have to be insurance backed that would cover necessary costs for more complicated matters.
Would anyone be prepared to join such a scheme? Maybe the solicitors could be 'chained' to each other so the service is still available at another office if you move house.
Would anyone be prepared to join such a scheme? Maybe the solicitors could be 'chained' to each other so the service is still available at another office if you move house.
I think the problem with any large scheme is that advice can only be given according to what the advisor is told. Often (usually) the inquirer's circumstances are more complex than can be dealt with by "simple" answers.
I agree that law professionals could use modern communication methods to help to keep prices down and my experience is that they do and I trusted that advice and communication just as much as i did when I met the person face to face. Additionally it was much more convenient than arranging appointments.
My understanding is that much of the underlying cost of legal advice is the research work involved and the professional insurance needed to protect practitioners if (when lol) thing go wrong and they are themselves sued.
I agree that law professionals could use modern communication methods to help to keep prices down and my experience is that they do and I trusted that advice and communication just as much as i did when I met the person face to face. Additionally it was much more convenient than arranging appointments.
My understanding is that much of the underlying cost of legal advice is the research work involved and the professional insurance needed to protect practitioners if (when lol) thing go wrong and they are themselves sued.
> I think it comes down to “cost”. If you look at the traditional lawyer’s firm, they have considerable overheads. Consequently, the hourly rate has to cover all those overheads and make a profit.
An interesting idea. Given that you propose a “virtual law” service, that suggests that the main overheads you see being saved are the costs of offices, utilities, etc. But many other offices are run at much lower hourly charge-out rates, suggesting that the main overhead of law firms is actually the cost of labour. Would lawyers charge less if they could give their advice from home?
Also, as a professional who has teleworked for a long time, IMO there are things you miss out on by not being together. Permanent teleworking could work for an individual lawyer, but for a law firm that wanted to present a consistent corporate face and maintain standards and processes across all staff/partners, you need a central place of work that everybody attends for at least some of their working week/month. Thus the overheads are still there, at least to some extent.
An interesting idea. Given that you propose a “virtual law” service, that suggests that the main overheads you see being saved are the costs of offices, utilities, etc. But many other offices are run at much lower hourly charge-out rates, suggesting that the main overhead of law firms is actually the cost of labour. Would lawyers charge less if they could give their advice from home?
Also, as a professional who has teleworked for a long time, IMO there are things you miss out on by not being together. Permanent teleworking could work for an individual lawyer, but for a law firm that wanted to present a consistent corporate face and maintain standards and processes across all staff/partners, you need a central place of work that everybody attends for at least some of their working week/month. Thus the overheads are still there, at least to some extent.
How about something like a "Walk in Wednesday" where a group of solicitors from your local area hire a hall and invite people in need of advice to come and get some guidance as to direction and estimated cost of the work involved. It could be like "Antiques Roadshow" where someone at the door could direct them to a specialist in their particular problem. eg. Divorce, wills, leasehold properties, criminal law etc.
Follow ups could then be in the solicitors chambers and be fully chargeable.
Follow ups could then be in the solicitors chambers and be fully chargeable.
Would lawyers charge less if they could give their advice from home?
Yes, Ellipsis. I do 70% of my work from home and consequently charge considerably less for paperwork than for Court appearances since I have no travel time and no travel costs. Most stuff can be emailed in or out (so no printing costs) either. AND I can look like a hag all day and the clients don't care!!!
Yes, Ellipsis. I do 70% of my work from home and consequently charge considerably less for paperwork than for Court appearances since I have no travel time and no travel costs. Most stuff can be emailed in or out (so no printing costs) either. AND I can look like a hag all day and the clients don't care!!!
As you say cost is the issue and cost equates to time.
Therefore to make it cheaper you have to make it faster but this is a direct trade of with quality.
You could for example abolish the right of appeal in certain cases and limit the time for the sides to make their case.
That would make it faster and hence cheaper
Obviously that would impact the quality of the legal process.
I don't know the answer to this but as a matter of interest do you have any idea whether cases are any cheaper under Roman Law based legal systems as practiced in Europe compared to case law based systems in the UK and US?
Therefore to make it cheaper you have to make it faster but this is a direct trade of with quality.
You could for example abolish the right of appeal in certain cases and limit the time for the sides to make their case.
That would make it faster and hence cheaper
Obviously that would impact the quality of the legal process.
I don't know the answer to this but as a matter of interest do you have any idea whether cases are any cheaper under Roman Law based legal systems as practiced in Europe compared to case law based systems in the UK and US?
Barmaid, surely you are getting 7 years no claims bonus on your bit of professional insurance?If it's a chambers policy, I should keep an eye on the others !
We need a service like NHS Direct. A lot of laymen's worries and questions are based on misconceptions about the law and are readily answered. And a lot can be easily 'diagnosed' and dealt with on a few questions. That at least, could save people a lot of worry and a lot of future trouble by early diagnosis of what the legal problem is and how to resolve it before getting into needless litigation or suffering consequences which could have been avoided.
There must be many cases, like ones we often see on here, and resolve, which fall into the above categories.
We need a service like NHS Direct. A lot of laymen's worries and questions are based on misconceptions about the law and are readily answered. And a lot can be easily 'diagnosed' and dealt with on a few questions. That at least, could save people a lot of worry and a lot of future trouble by early diagnosis of what the legal problem is and how to resolve it before getting into needless litigation or suffering consequences which could have been avoided.
There must be many cases, like ones we often see on here, and resolve, which fall into the above categories.
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