Self-Gratification

[Scarlett]

What do you think of self-gratification as a lifestyle choice? ie- doing exactly what you like to do because it pleases you? Having a good time all the time? Focusing on what makes you happy? Or is it important to do some things that you don't enjoy, or that you do out of duty?

[Old_Geezer]

I sometimes wonder what the point of existence is, and when I find nothing that lasts wonder if searching to increase happiness might be the right aim after all. But I think it best not to ignore other's happiness level too.

[bednobs]

i think it would work only if few people decided to do it - society as we know it would cease to exist if everyone decided that was the way to go

[ck1]

Is it possible to ignore all of the duties and things you don't necessarily enjoy?

[gness]

It's not important to do things you don't enjoy or out of duty...necessary at times perhaps, but not important.
I think we can do things that please us and make us happy and focus on these things without them being selfish acts that can't or don't benefit others in our lives.

[Old_Geezer]

I think it should be about maximising rather than exclusivity. If you never do anything you don't like then there is a problem. But if you aim to get what needs to be done, done but finding maximum joy whilst doing so, that's workable.

[Mamyalynne]

Depending on your circumstances it is easy sometimes to become a bit self centred and just concentrate on what makes you happy - then the simplest of actions make you realise how helping others can give you such a boost.

I often wish I did more, but then we are all full of good intentions aren't we.

[Canary42]

Up to you really. If selfish hedonism floats your boat and you can afford it (both financially and emotionally, including society's attitude towards you) then go ahead.

[gness]

But if being the helpful neighbour....the man who gives a day to help at the old folk's home.....the baker/knitter for charity is exactly what you like to do and what makes you happy then making yourself happy is a good thing.
I do very little out of duty or that I don't enjoy...it's not important that I do these things...and, though they don't make me happy, I could stop doing them so they don't make me unhappy.

[boxtops]

it sounds to me very selfish. I'm all for making the most of life - but some things just have to be done, to keep us healthy (e.g. going to the dentist or cleaning the loo), or to keep the wheels of a pleasant society going. We do have a responsibility to our fellow man (and woman), IMO.

[boxtops]

^ and it's the selfish society that means that if it's fun to dig up your neighbour's plants and throw them in the street, or scrawl graffiti on the wall, then you just do it. Not in decent society, you don't.

[joggerjayne]

If you throw Jeremy Bentham, Immanuel Kant, and John Stuart Mill into one big melting pot, and stir up their respective ideas ...

What comes out is ...

Do what makes you happy ..

All the time ...

No matter how big or small ...

And ...

If we all do the same ...

We will achieve the maximum utilitarian benefit for humanity as a whole.

So, yes ... we should all try to have a good time, all the time.

Besides, life is kind of a bit too short to not have a good time.

[jno]

alas, if I decide shooting my neighbour makes me happy, it may not achieve the greatest benefit for him.

[joggerjayne]

Of course,mothers is also the argument that it is impossible to do anything other than self gratify.

If you do something out of "moral duty" ... there is the argument that your small sacrifice makes you feel better about yourself that if you had done the other thing, the one you really wanted to do.

In fact, the personal gratification from doing the thing you felt you ought to do, instead of the thing you wanted to do, provides a personal utilitarian factor greater than if you'd gone off and had a good time.

You feel good about yourself.

Or, to put it another way ... you're a smug git.

Which makes you feel happy.

Whereas, if you go off and have fun, then you feel guilty.

Which makes you feel sad.

So you have a better, happier time doing the thing you "ought" to do, rather than the thing you "want" to do.

[joggerjayne]

jno ... do you live next door to Gus Poyet?

[jno]

no, a foreigner but a nice one.

So when I am done with him humanity will have lost a nice foreigner and gained one cold-blooded killer. I am not sure this is a utilitarian benefit.

[joggerjayne]

Ah, yes. Well Kant (but not Bentham or Mill) suggested that the consequences of our actions are ... "morally irrelevant"

Arguably, that was something of a weakness in his theory.

[sandyRoe]

Would even the most avid sinner not eventually get sick of sin?
If all the years were playing holidays, to sport would be as tedious as work.

[sandyRoe]

and I notice as I get older that the urge to self gratify is much less fierce than it once was

[joggerjayne]

Sandy ... I must confess I also clicked on this thread thinking it was something to do with killing kittens.

[bednobs]

jayne, that kant sounds like a bit of a ...kant