A Message For The Anti-Vaxxers

[melv16]

https://amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/21/icu-is-full-of-the-unvaccinated-my-patience-with-them-is-wearing-thin?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM%3D#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16385460662865&;csi=0&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fworld%2F2021%2Fnov%2F21%2Ficu-is-full-of-the-unvaccinated-my-patience-with-them-is-wearing-thin

[anneasquith]

Sadly melv, I think it’s too late . The unvaccinated have had plenty of evidence re benefits of vaccinations.

[Stickybottle]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/nov/30/life-tragic-death-john-eyers-fitness-fanatic-who-refused-covid-vaccine

[William51]

It is bad when Anti-Vaxers die. Misplaced self confidence of survival is sad and hopefully others will learn from the tragic cases.

[melv16]

It could be a way of culling stupid idiots.

[dave50]

As long there are no restrictions put in place in order to protect this foolish minority.

[MrsCheese]

Great comment in the paper today:

I am so sick of these idiots who are jabbed and still do not seem to understand that their precious jab DOES NOT STOP YOU CATCHING OR TRANSMITTING THE VIRUS... in fact they do not seem to even know what their precious jab does but cannot wait to shut down any debate with name calling and threats. They have given up any rights for the sake of a shot that no company will ever be sued for if it damages or kills you. No consequences of any sort. But you expect me to run out and get one JUST BECAUSE YOU DID... no thank you. I still have FREE WILL & FREEDOM OF CHOICE. I respect your choice, now respect mine

[melv16]

//ICU is full of the unvaccinated – my patience with them is wearing thin.//
I take it you didn't read the link, mrscheese?
The article is written by a specialist in resperitory desease. I think I'll take his advice rather than yours.

[Stickybottle]

MrsCheese
Great comment in the paper today:

I am so sick of these idiots who are jabbed and still do not seem to understand that their precious jab DOES NOT STOP YOU CATCHING OR TRANSMITTING THE VIRUS... in fact they do not seem to even know what their precious jab does but cannot wait to shut down any debate with name calling and threats

But it does vastly increase your chances of survival should you be unfortunate enough to contract it
Feel free to continue on your course of natural selection though

[gness]

How can I respect the choice of the anti-vaxers when they are putting the lives of others at risk and continue putting a disproportionate load on NHS resources as they are doing now. Shameful people.

[sunny-dave]

Anyone refusing to be vaccinated poses a risk to the vaccinated population – as well as a much greater risk to themselves and other unvaccinated persons.

An unvaccinated person is roughly 10 times more likely to contract Covid than a vaccinated person of the same age. Once they have the disease they are 6 times (at least) more likely to wind up in hospital and 10 times more likely to need ICU treatment once hospitalised. Therefore ...

1. There is an increased risk of infection to individual vaccinated persons – an unvaccinated person is much more likely to be ill with Covid-19 at some point, and will also be shedding a maximum viral load for much longer whilst in the infectious stage of the illness (recovery times are significantly longer in unvaccinated people).

2. A significant pool of infection continuing in unvaccinated persons provides increased opportunity for more harmful variants to develop.

Thus it is obvious that choosing not to be vaccinated (which is an entirely personal decision which I respect) has implications not just for the individual, but for wider society too.

So - to summarise :

“You have the right to choose not be vaccinated, but society has the right to protect its other members from the consequences of your decision”

[Atheist]

Sunny; I think that some people are not intellectually able to follow arguments like yours.

[Atheist]

They know what they think, and they aren't going to change their view whatever you say. Anti-vax is a sort of religion - faith and disregard of rational argument is what it's all about.

[zylaphone]

Mrs Cheese, please stay at home so you don’t infect other people and catch it yourself. Your choice, how can us lay people know more the professional people?

[Barsel]

If someone wasn't vaccinated and got Covid, became very ill but then recovered, could they then (if they decided to) be vaccinated if being ill changed their mind?

[rockyracoon]

"“You have the right to choose not be vaccinated, but society has the right to protect its other members from the consequences of your decision”"

That. In a nutshell.

[rockyracoon]

"If someone wasn't vaccinated and got Covid, became very ill but then recovered, could they then (if they decided to) be vaccinated if being ill changed their mind?"

Can't see any reason why not.

[sunny-dave]

Yes - Barsel - they can :

"Because it’s possible to get reinfected and COVID-19 can cause severe medical complications, the CDC recommends that people who have already had COVID-19 get a COVID-19 vaccine.

In addition, COVID-19 vaccination might offer better protection than getting sick with COVID-19. A recent study showed that unvaccinated people who already had COVID-19 are more than twice as likely as fully vaccinated people to get reinfected with COVID-19.

Recent research also suggests that people who got COVID-19 in 2020 and then received mRNA vaccines produce very high levels of antibodies that are likely effective against current and, possibly, future variants. Some scientists call this hybrid immunity. Further research is needed.

If you were treated for COVID-19 with monoclonal antibodies or convalescent plasma, wait 90 days before getting a COVID-19 vaccine."

[royfromaus]

I really don't understand why these so-called anti-vaxxers are being made into pariahs.

You can catch covid and spread it, zylaphone...best you stay at home too.

[sunny-dave]

Royfromaus - it's about the likelihood of someone being infected and then the level of their infectious risk to others - both are *much* higher in the unvaccinated. So their personal choice has a significant impact on others - not least in the disproportionate use of scarce NHS resources by the unvaccinated.

I refer you to my (lengthy) post at 19:03.

[Barsel]

Thank you rr and sd.