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Hey as I said before, I love you guys. So much useful info, however here is the state of play at my place right now. I overcame the irrisistable force/unmoveble object back in the summer of 84, got it down to a fine art the following bank holiday monday, so that ain't the prob. Got the hamster fed also, so thanks again there. Have taken time to read all the instruction manuals that come with the particle acelerator (principa mathmatica, foquets theorm, and The Famous Five to name but a few) so herein may lie the problem. Someone has mysteriously ripped out the last page of "The Famous Five Does sub-atomic-quantum-mechanics" You are all such a great bunch on this site, I fear I may have yet more problems for my mates here at AB to solve, in fact I feel another one comming on right now.......................lol ;)