Who Will Hold The £100 Billion Energy Subsidy Debt?

[flobadob]

I may be wrong, but I think I read recently that when the UK applies the caps on energy prices to customers, they are really just paying the difference to the energy companies, by getting loans of up to £100 billion. If true, this will be a bigger bill than covid was.

But where does the money actually come from? Who does the £100 billion actually have to get paid back to?

[Buenchico]

>>> Who does the £100 billion actually have to get paid back to?

Whoever buys the bonds:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50504151

[New Judge]

Not quite bigger than Covid.

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-9309/CBP-9309.pdf

"The Covid-19 pandemic has resulted in very high levels of public spending. Current estimates of the cost of Government measures announced so far range from about £310 to £410 billion. This is the equivalent of about £4,600 to £6,100 per person in the UK."

This is a result of successive government abrogating their responsibility to ensure the UK's energy independence and security. In 2011 Nick Clegg (remember him - then Deputy Prime Minister?) turned down the idea of spending on nuclear power stations as "they wouldn't be ready until 2022." Guess what year we're in now? As recently as 2017 Centrica closed the Rough Gas Storage facility off the east coast. This facility doubles the entire UK storage capacity. The installation needed repairs and the government would not underwrite the cost.

So now the taxpayer has to underwrite the cost of paying the market rate for gas and electricity for at least the next two years, and probably longer than that. You gets what you pays for (or in the UK's case, what it wouldn't pay for).

[archibaldy]

NJ: // Nick Clegg //

Why are you quoting a politician? I thought you didn't believe anything they say?

[flobadob]

Buen, that's crazy, they basically admit that national debt will never be paid off, which I'm assuming is true of a lot of countries. But what kind of problems did that lead to, surely it all has to fall apart at some stage?

[flobadob]

Judge, a lot of that sounds the same as Ireland, though we owe over €40,000 each for every person in the country, so even more screwed. A lot of people would hold the Green Party accountable for the poor decisions made on energy issues. They are an 8% party, but because they have propped up the government throughout the 2000's they've got a lot of their wishes granted.

[Peter Pedant]

it will float
like a fart in a toom

[Peter Pedant]

//The installation needed repairs and the government would not underwrite the cost.//

god I am not surprised - it is obviously an operating cost that should be depreciated against operating income over 20 y
Jesus.

[Old_Geezer]

But we are paying the price, a private company isn't showing interest in bothering. For vital national utilities Nationalisation is a good option.

[Zacs-Master]

But it’s not the Uk energy distributing companies who are dictating the prices. It’s the energy providers.

[youngmafbog]

//But it’s not the Uk energy distributing companies who are dictating the prices. It’s the energy providers.//

Well not quite, its the wholesale market price that is determined by how much people will pay (good old supply demand graph).

[youngmafbog]

//For vital national utilities Nationalisation is a good option.//

I this case it would make little difference, might even be worse as at least private companies want things to keep running to make money. If Nationalised most likely the Unions would have them out on strike on top of the price problem - which they would have to pay anyway as its a world determined price.

[youngmafbog]

To answer the OP.

It is the tax payer who ultimately pays, the Government doesnt have any actual money of their own.

[New Judge]

//Why are you quoting a politician? I thought you didn't believe anything they say?//

When we first began discussing my strategy of disbelieving everything politicians tell me I qualified my disbelief by adding "occasionally one of them will tell the truth and you will then be pleasantly surprised." On this occasion Mr Clegg told the truth and I was surprised - though not pleasantly.

//A lot of people would hold the Green Party accountable for the poor decisions made on energy issues. They are an 8% party, but because they have propped up the government throughout the 2000's they've got a lot of their wishes granted.//

Indeed. And that's what's happening in the UK even though the Green Party polled only 2.6% of the votes in England & Wales at the last General Election. The ridiculous "Net Zero" strategy has caused enormous harm to the country's energy security, depending on irregular sources of energy for an increasing proportion of supply. The chickens are now coming home to roost.

[archibaldy]

Aah I see… Disbelieve unless you personally believe that they are telling the truth. Nice one.

[New Judge]

//Aah I see… Disbelieve unless you personally believe that they are telling the truth. Nice one.//

Not quite, archie. I don't believe anything they tell me **will** happen unless and until I see it occur. I don't believe anything they tell me **has** happened unless I see verification from another source.

[archibaldy]

So which part of what Nick Clegg said did you see occur then?

[New Judge]

We got to 2021 and no new nuclear power stations had been commissioned. (He said there wouldn't be any because they take ten years to build).

I think we've done this, don't you?

[archibaldy]

That's not what 'occurred' though is it.. He speculated on a date that may or may not have been true - you don't know, and never will - but you are 'believing' him and quoting him now because it suits your narrative at the moment.

Yes, it's boring, but as, when we talk about Brexit lies, you disparage people for believing what politicians say, and you // don't believe any politicians, whatever they tell me // I felt it worth exploring how true that is, and I am unconvinced.

In any case, for what it's worth I happen to agree with you wholeheartedly on the points in your original post in here about the energy situation.