Deceased Estates

[Bazile]

Can anyone help with some info please .

1.Husband dies first - his will , includes some benefits to go to wife and daughter .

2. Daughter dies second - (no will made ) - so her estate will go to her brothers , according to the rules

3. Wife dies third - her will , includes some benefits to go to husband and daughter


The sons/brothers will inherit the estates of the dad , mother and sister in the end

Is there still a requirement for some sort of legal paperwork/process to be done by the executor of the husband and wife's estate ( who will be one of the sons - who will also be dealing with his sister estate ) , to still transfer the benefits stated in wills, from husband's estate , to the wife and daughters estate / wife's estate to the husband and daughter's estate - ( even though all three are deceased ) ?

or

Can the executor proceed directly, to distribute the estates to the inheritors ?


Also the government site states that the Inheritance Tax form must be submitted at the same time you submit the probate application forms .
However how can you complete the inheritance tax forms accurately , before probate is granted , given that you will need to show evidence that you have been granted probate , in order to approach banks pensions companies etc , for information as to what accounts they have and monies therein ?

I hope you can understand my questions

Thanks for any help

[Tilly2]

Bazile, how complicated this all is. I can only help by saying that after my Dad died the bank gave me a copy of his latest statements so that I knew how much money was involved and could fill out the necessary forms. The Life assurance companies also gave me, on the phone, a figure for the life assured. I think the executors probably need to ask some questions, of the right people, in order to be able to fill in the forms correctly.

[woofgang]

It may be a bit different as it was a husband and wife situation, but everyone I spoke to apart from Homeserve were happy to begin talking to me on the basis of receipt or sight of a registered copy of the death certificate.

[Peter Pedant]

SOrry that so many of your relations have died within weeks of each other. Obvious case for a probate practitioner I would have thought

b) I thought the parent took precedence in intestacy rather than a sib but so what so long as no one is complaining

selling a house w/o probate I thought was difficult - but again so what. - I used the will only with a small estate case ( as a walk-in executor rather than a lawyer) so small that he was insolvent.

it is possible to hire a lawyer and do the main donkey work yourself ( saves chargeable time and therefore fees)

we used a licensed conveyancer to transfer land into our names on my mothers death - they coped with the fact that no one had touched the paper title deeds since my father bought it in 1962.

[Bazile]

Thanks .

I'm confident of dealing with the estates .

I just need to know if there is a legal requirement process that the executor needs to do and transfer benefits stated in the Husband and wifes will , between them , (even though they are all deceased ) , before their estates are paid out to the final inheritors

[Barmaid]

Right you do not need a Grant to get the information from the companies. You write to them, enclosing a copy of the death certificate and a copy of the Will and ask them to provide details of the accounts for probate purposes. You may have to explain the order of deaths and provide other death certificates. Essentially the organisations are looking for evidence of death and evidence that you are the person dealing with the estate. Once you have this info you can apply for Probate - if necessary.

In my view, if each estate is below the nil rate band, you will only need Probate if the deceased held assets in their own name and if those assets are over, say, 15k. So for example if the daughter had no assets in her own name and the estate only comprises the inheritance from her father, then you shouldnt need probate and can pay direct to the beneficiaries. (Although naturally any debts will have to be discharged first).

Once you have the Grant you can send it to the banks etc to release the funds.

[Bazile]

Thanks Barmaid
I'll need Probate as her estate is worth over 15k

Given that she died before her mum and her mum's estate has not been sorted yet -do I have to do anything - paperwork or otherwise ; with regard to moving what her mum left her , into her estate ; or does it automatically become part of her estate ?

[Buenchico]

When a beneficiary dies before the testator then
(a) if the beneficiary was a child of the testator and had children of their own, anything which was destined for the beneficiary passes, in equal shares, to their children ;
(b) if the beneficiary was a child of the testator but had no children OR if the beneficiary was not a child of the testator, then where there is a 'residuary beneficiary' (i.e. the will says something like "Everything else I leave to Fred Bloggs") then what should have gone to the deceased beneficiary passes to the residuary beneficiary ;
(c) where the circumstances of (b) apply, but there is no 'residuary beneficiary' (or if the residuary beneficiary also pre-deceased the testator) then a 'partial intestacy' is created, meaning that whatever should have passed to the deceased beneficiary has to be allocated according to the rules on intestacy.

So what the wife left to her daughter, in your question, would pass to that daughter's children if she had any. I assume from the wording of your question though that she didn't, so whatever should have gone to the daughter now has to be dealt with under the intestacy rules (UNLESS the the wife's will named a residuary beneficiary, in which case it goes to them instead)

Similarly, what the wife intended to go to her husband must now also be dealt with under the intestacy rules (again UNLESS there was a residuary beneficiary in the wife's will).

Intestacy rules here:
https://www.kingstonsmith.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Intestacy-Rules-flowchart-if-you-live-in-england-1.pdf

[fiction-factory]

Sorry to intrude, Bazile, but I wanted to catch Buenchico's attention to this thread as I wondered if he could work out what was being asked on this thread
http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Science/Question1551787.html

[Bazile]

Thanks for that Chris