Who Legally Owns This?? (Though I’m Sure It’s More Complicated Then I’d Like)

[Smowball]

Long story short - less than a year ago we agreed to lend my daughter & her partner £3k to buy a static caravan, which they were going to live in while they saved up a deposit for a house. She was overdrawn so asked if we cud pay it into his bank, which we did. He msgd me as soon as money arrived & said Thanku, & he wud pay money back asap. Fast forward to this week - he has now decided that he wants out of this relationship but not only that, he wants my daughter and the two girls to move out! He is insisting on staying in the caravan, saying it is his! She is obviously very upset, and doesn't want to leave as she has nowhere to go. (She can come here of course but the girls have school). The deal was the caravan was to be sold as soon as they had bought a house and no longer needed it, or if they then chose to rent elsewhere, not as a permanent home for him!! 
Where does she/we stand on this??I've a feeling I know the answer but just thought I'd ask my good friends on here.

[Tilly2]

Did he pay the money back, Smow?

[Smowball]

Nope, not a penny.

[naomi24]

Are the girls his children?

[Old_Geezer]

You need a legal eagle.

 

Did they buy the caravan in his name or joint names ?  And does the law recognise single ownership in such situations.

 

He seems to be the one loaned the money as it went into his account, so it is fair you ask for repayment if you wish. In which case he'd need to go get a loan to cover it; but that would sort of confirm his ownership.

 

Again; you need experts to advise.

[ToraToraTora]

if its in his name he owns it. He also owes money to whoever lent it. If there is no formal agreement signed then almost impossible to get back. You could file a small claims case if you have any sort of supporting evidence for the loan.

[Smowball]

Yes they are his children. Nothing legal was ever drawn up - I've known him 15 years, but he seems to have had some kind of brainstorm - it's bizarre. All I've got is a txt message from him thanking me for the money and that he would pay it back asap, and also a message from her at the same time saying that C***** says Thanku very much for the money and he will pay you back asap soon as possible.

[Smowball]

I'm actually not 100% sure whose name they then bought the caravan in - will check with her this morning.

[douglas9401]

In my limited experience the law tends to side with the female side in a dispute and the male is on the streets.

[naomi24]

Your daughter really does need to get proper legal advice.  I suspect the law might have something to say about him kicking his own children out of their home.

[Tilly2]

I suspect thar the caravan cost more than £3000. Hhere did the rest of the money come from? More loans?

[Peter Pedant]

oo where is Barmaid ?

the law is clear

ll I've got is a txt message from him thanking me for the money and that he would pay it back asap, and also a message from her at the same time saying that C***** says Thanku very much for the money and he will pay you back asap soon as possible.

shows it is a loan secured on the caravan ( but is that a dwelling?) - so you have a claim. Make sure you keep copies of the texts

the law is "purchase of a house in the name of another" . In the leading case it was  held that a contributor to a house purchase created an automatic trust/ interest - but I cant find the case ( It isnt Keech v Sanford)

so the law and evidence is straightforward and on  your side. BUT.... employing a lawyer is much more expensive ( = not worth it) - so as usual, it is all to be done by negotiation

[Smowball]

Tilly , it's only a second hand one - it was in a right state when they got it. Daughter gutted it and painted it all, put lino down, new cupboard doors etc etc.... but I will double check if they did indeed add a bit more to the £3k.

[Peter Pedant]

Your daughter really does need to get proper legal advice. 

er at £200/h -  I think she knew lawyers were better than answerbank walkins

I didnt do Family Law - kicking dependent kids out, I agree would not be supported by a juddge ( more lawyers more money)

[Smowball]

Ooh PP Thanku for looking all that up! I agree that even if law is on my side, the cost of lawyer etc just wouldn't be worth it. Would have liked to think he would do the right thing - either pay me back, or move out himself and let daughter and the girls stay in it for the time being. But, to add to the complication - the caravan is on his parents land! 

[Peter Pedant]

You can rely on

"I have a docuument ( text - see Horison) that shows he admits a loan and not "a sum that includes expense set off like carpets and chairs""

Going to a lawyer - oo-er Mrs  !

[naomi24]

I don't think the text message does show that the loan was for a caravan - unless it actually says that.  Borrowed money for an undefined purpose can be spent anywhere.  

[naomi24]

Smow, your daughter can speak to a lawyer free of charge at Citizebs Advice.

[naomi24]

*Citizens.

[Peter Pedant]

citizens advice are very good at debt so cast this as a debt -  we got an eighteen year old adviser -  but he was right !

[Peter Pedant]

please note mods do not know as much about equity as they may consider they do

There is a presumption, which can be rebutted by evidence, that the legal owner holds the property on trust for the person who financed the purchase. So if Mr A provides money to Mr B to buy a property that is registered in Mr B's name there is a presumption that Mr B holds the property on resulting trust for Mr A

phew phound it ! - I was searching implied trust ( difft)