Andrew Wakefield Rises Again.....

[mushroom25]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jul/18/how-disgraced-anti-vaxxer-andrew-wakefield-was-embraced-by-trumps-america

another round of MMR vs Anti-vax, and this time he has the ear of some currently influential Americans. years have passed and yet the fire of this controversy refuses to be extinguished. in discrediting his research, are the UK medical authorities sure they got it right?

[sunny-dave]

Yes they are right - he is a charlatan and results fiddler of the first order who has killed more children than just about any other "medical professional", by convincing the gullible not to vaccinate their children.

[Mamyalynne]

He's amongst the last any Country needs to show his face again.

[Minkyme]

I wouldn’t be surprised if he was //adopted// by ex president bushes cronies.

[ichkeria]

Matteo Salvini was another MMR denier.
And look where he is now ...

[Peter Pedant]

// any other "medical professional", by convincing the gullible not to vaccinate their children.//

are we sre that he is a charlatan ?
yes quite sure -

the damage he did lives after him - each measles epidemic there are deaths which are completely avoidable

the real damage to his reputation was not being struck off by the english GMC - but that Horton admitted the Lancet should never have printed the article.

not sure how he got overthat one

[douglas9401]

He should be horsewhipped to within an inch of his life, then somebody else should take over.

[douglas9401]

...and finish the job.

[youngmafbog]

Quite Douglas and bring back the stocks whilst we are at it.

[Old_Geezer]

Looks to be more anti-MMR vaccine than anti-vaccine to me.
Anyway internal US policy is a US issue. Doesn't look the sort of issue we need to tell them they've wrong about. They have the evidence already.

[Peter Pedant]

we had two deaths in Manchester from measles
whilst the parents swanned around talking about the freedom to choose the best for their children ....

[andres]

My own doctor many years ago did say that if we continued vaccinating against measles it would return with a vengeange in the years to come. Looks as though he was right.

[Peter Pedant]

// My own doctor ... did say that if we continued vaccinating against measles it would return with a vengeange in the years to come.//

then he must have missed his vaccy lecture at med school
Measles is returning in the UNvaccinated group

as one wd expect in the suceptible population
what was not anticipated was that public health programmes for the whole group would be later perceived as a matter of choice....

[andres]

Got called away and just seen this reply.
You are wrong PP--Some vaccinated people can still contract the measles disease.

[Peter Pedant]

we arent talking about whether Measles vacc is 100%
it is whether it occurs in vaccinated children in a more malignant form
No it doesnt

He may have been talking about "modified measles" which occurred in the early seventies after an earlier measles vaccine but this is not seen now. or not
he cd have been talking about the Black Death or Fifth disease or Lupus or .....

God how patients pick up on rubbish and treat it as the gospel truth

[andres]

Sometimes you are too arrogant PP. I was referring to recent cases of vaccinated people getting measles nothing to do with the doctor that I mentioned. He said that back in the 70s and it was his opinion then not mine. Why don't you read up on the subject instead of being so rude .

[fiveleaves]

I have long been suspicious of the intense castigation of Andrew Wakefield.
I used to work with people with autism and heard stories from parents that their children had "normal" development in the 1st years of their life and then something went wrong

[jim360]

Can you remember *why* your doctor said what they said, andres?

Also, to the last post, that's kind of how autism works: it's not usually present, noticeably speaking, from the exact moment of birth. What you're observing is essentially a coincidence, and is exactly the same mistake that Wakefield originally made.

[andres]

Jim360--Almost50 years ago now but I think it was something to do with either the immune system becoming suppressed or people becoming complacent about vaccinations. Sorry can't be more explicit but it was just a remark that stuck in my mind.

[jim360]

Ah, well, shame you've forgotten why -- I hope you can see that the reason makes a big difference, especially as the two alternatives you've offered are radically different. If the second one, then arguably your doctor predicted the Wakefield effect, etc (ie, people being duped into believing what he was saying while forgetting the dangers of Measles).

On the other hand, if the first, then... I don't understand for a second what he would be trying to say. There's not a shred of credible evidence that vaccines suppress the immune system; indeed, the exact opposite is, by definition true: they enhance the immune system (albeit with the need for a couple of booster jabs later).

See, for example, https://tinyurl.com/y9scdfqc , which is a review of the evidence (or rather, the lack of it) for links between vaccination programmes and weakened immune systems.