Religion and Schools

[gedk]

I would appreciate some views on my situation please. I am not particularly religious and I do not go to church. This coming October I will be applying for a nursey place for my son. I want to send him to a voluntary aided church of england and catholic primary school which also has a nursery. I want to send him to this school because it is the best primary school in my area (I have checked Ofsted reports etc and the school's results are excellent and well above the national average). It also happens to be 5 minutes around the corner from where I live. The nursery and school are always heavily oversubscribed and priority is given to the "children whose parents / guardians are most faithful to the Roman Catholic or Anglican Church" (taken from the school's admission policy). Points are awarded to you based on how many times you go to church and also how "involved" you get with the day to day running of the church, going around with the collection plate, getting involved with the summer fetes etc (you get my drift). The church even gives out "tokens" which you need to collect, you need at least 30 to get a place in the school and they are given out on a totally random basis so basically you have to go every week on the off chance that they are given out. You even sign in to prove that you were there!

My husband and I are now faced with the prospect of having to attend church every Sunday just to try and get my son into the school that I want. I don't particularly want to but I will do it because I want the best for my son. I guess my point is this; is this really what religion is all about? Do you really think God wants his churches full of parents who are only there because they want a school place for their child? Has anybody else any experience of this? What are you thoughts?

[Maggimae]

I have applied for a placement for my four year old daughter at primary school and one of my choices for schools (I had to give 3 choices) was a local C of E school because it is renowned as one of the best schools in the area although out of my catchment. They recently sent me an application form which did ask me if the family regularly attended church. We dont. However, I used to go this very school myself at primary school age and my parents never attended church but I am presuming the criteria to get into these schools is either now stricter and maybe its because we are not in the immediate catchment area for the school that they use this to help them decide which children out of the catchment area they will take. I definately think that C of E and catholic schools are really good schools and maybe this is because they are structured around religion and good basic values but thats not to say that there arent really good non-religious schools available either. The school in my immediate catchment area isnt C of E or Catholic and has a great reputation and standard of education. Whether anyone else would actually agree with me on this one, but perhaps you could attend church until you secure a place for your son at your chosen school. I mean people do it all the time when they want to get married in church, they attend for a temporary period just to get granted a licence to get married there. I know at the end of the day is not what religion is all about and basically not what the school is trying to promote, but as your sons education is a priority I cant see what it would really hurt. Good luck x

[redcrx]

I went to a catholic school run by nuns. It is the best school in the town.

Pupils were taken if their parents could afford the fees and thats it. I am CofE and we went to the Catholic church for special services and to the chapel in the convent too. My brother and sisters also went there and they werent even christened, all that the school was interested in was the fee. We did however get a good religious education and have all grown up to be good mannered adults with a well rounded education.

If you are really set on the idea of your child attending this school then its a small sacrifice to make surely?

The school has a right to take whichever pupils it sees fit. It sounds as if church going will be your only option.

[kevb0444]

Hi....doesn't this mean that this school is discriminating you? It sounds like a stupid way to "get the numbers up" at there church. Some people seem to think religion is jst a numbers game. It's also away for them to stop any "unwanted" children from there school. It makes you wonder about the teachings of the school in question. I guess that as they are a church of england school then they only want students who are of the same faith.

[Goodsoulette]

My son goes to a CofE voluntarily contributed school which means the church pats for everything. They didnt have to accept anyone they ndidnt want to. We also lived over a mile away from the school with 4 others being much closer. I never go to church but i knew what a good school it is. We somehow got him in there. Good luck!! In retrospect I think home has a lot to do with how well a child progresses and with a loveing and encouraging family life I am sure he will prosper wherever he attends.

[beryllium]

hmmmmm, kind of strange isn't it?

The best education a child can get these days is through the Catholic or Church of England etc schools.

I wonder why? now, you are athiest? agnostic or what? how will your views affect your littlun when they have R.E lessons.

Why don't you want to go to church? you dont support it, but you support their ways of education.....

You know, they're not bad places... rather peaceful actually....

Dont knock it till you try it. And..... i guess 'God' only wants to give children a good chance in life as he gave you.... and if you are not to happy to give back to the church and help out, why should you get the chance to have your littlun educated by them?

[jake-the-peg]

Things vary an awful lot around the country but I would expect that the school does not have complete freedom to pick and choose and that a certain proportion will have to come from the catchment area regardless of religous orientation - they are after all partly state funded aren't they? You might find your proximity would get you a place anyway.

I Personally have strong views on religion and avoided the local Catholic Primary school partly because despite their good results I would be simply unable to support their ethical and religous teaching and it would just cause trouble.

Remember also a lot depends on how "bad" the alternative is. Cherry picking kids from religious backgrounds often equates to picking kids from middle class backgrounds with supportive parents. Often that is what gives them the good results rather than the standard of teaching and your child may do as well or better in a non-religious school with your support.

Having said that there are some awful schools out there where the brightest most supported child would founder.

Hard choice - just remember it's not for nothing that the Jesuits say "Give me the child until he is 7 and I'll give you the man"

[SaxyJag]

As a voluntary aided school, the governing body can decide on the admissions criteria. There's an explanation here and on the linked pages:-
http://www.direct.gov.uk/EducationAndLearning/ Schools/ChoosingASchool/ChoosingASchoolArticle s/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4016312&chk=mIV5hAhttp: //www.direct.gov.uk/EducationAndLearning/Schoo ls/ChoosingASchool/ChoosingASchoolArticles/fs/ en?CONTENT_ID=4016312&chk=mIV5hA

GedK, if you're really concerned about the admission criteria and really don't feel you want to go to church regularly, then I think you should question whether it's the best school for your son. If you feel at odds with their admissions policy, then who's to say you won't meet similar policies down the line that you're equally uneasy about.

There's more to a good school than a decent Ofsted report and high SATs results. They're just an indicator of how well the school is able to conform to government guidelines and can get the kids to do the same. I used to work for a local authority advisory team, and believe me, the best 'performing' schools weren't always the best ones overall. With your and his teachers' support, your child can do well in even the poorest 'performing' school.

Now, a religious school would be my last choice in any case, but try to look at it from their point of view. They get these wonderful results, so it's natural that everyone (well, not quite everyone) wants their child to go there. But how would you feel if you were devout Roman Catholics wanting a Catholic-based education for your child and yet he was turned down because the last place had been filled by a child whose family have

[SaxyJag]

Sorry, that was a lousy link. Try this one:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/EducationAndLearning/ Schools/fs/en

[SaxyJag]

And sorry (again), but the end of that post should have read:

But how would you feel if you were devout Roman Catholics wanting a Catholic-based education for your child and yet he was turned down because the last place had been filled by a child whose family have more secular ideals and are only sending their child there because the school gets good results.

Try visiting a few other schools before you make your final decision. You may be surprised.

[Goodsoulette]

Jake the Peg... I can assure you that the school my son attends is solely funded by the church. It was very clearly pointed out in the admissions booklet that the school could turn down and admit anyone they wanted for whatever reasons. John does a little more at religious festival times but he also learning to embrace other religions there too. He is 5 and he already has a good grasp of what Judaism and Islam entail, as an agnostic I feel this is preparing him better to become a more understandin and tolerant person than a child that attends a school that ignores religious beliefs.