Proposals for Care Fees

[Hastler]

Reading recent proposal re care home fees one is a proposal for a £100,000 cap and another is for a loan so the person can keep their house till after their death.
I am just wondering how many pensioners have £100,000 when they enter a nursing home.
Most of my friends have had half of the parets house left to them on the death of the mother or father and the parent only owns half of the house and as the savings tend to be low when the person enters a nursing home many will not have £100,000.
Also with regard to keeping a persons house till after they pass away again I can not see any point.
The house will have to be insured etc even if it is empty.

[sandyRoe]

A 100 K Tory death tax? If your assets are worth more than that you get to keep the difference to leave to your children.

[Hastler]

Hi Sandy

People will only pay up to £100,000 if they need care so this will not apply to everybody.

[Brenden]

The loan will accrue interest Hastler, so goodness know what will be owed at the end of the day.

[factor-fiction]

This is a very tricky area. Care home costs can be substantial and have to be paid for somehow. It seems right that a multi-millionaire should pay for care, either directly or after his death by a charge on his estate. But we have to ensure that the charges don't encourage people to be feckless with their money and deter them from saving or looking after their assets. And we also have to ensure that care home fee avoidance schemes don't become a major industry.

But, Hastler, I'm not sure I understand the bit about:

"Also with regard to keeping a person's house till after they pass away again I cannot see any point.The house will have to be insured etc even if it is empty."

Doesn't this happen already unless the house is sold to fund the fees. Under the suggested arrangements wouldn't there still be the option of selling the house?

[Hastler]

Hi factor30

I am sure there will be the option to sell the house.
What I am saying is whats the point in keeping it if there is no prospect of the person returning to it and the house is not occupied.
Avoidance of care home fees is an industry now to some extent now.
Parents often leave half the house to the offspring when one of them dies so at least half the house can not be taken for care home fees.
If this happens and the child return's home to live in the house through being widowed for example the council can not take any of the house even if the child is a multimillionaire as long as they keep it till after the parent passes away.
I am sure in this situation most parents will make sure they have very little cash towards the end.

[Graham-W]

You would also have the option of letting the house with the income generated paying towards the care home costs.

[Hastler]

Probably not if the child is living in the property.

[factor-fiction]

If the child is living in the property then it won't be empty

[bednobs]

true - what is the point in keeping a house you are not going to return to - may as well sell it and pay your own way at the nursing home

[Hastler]

Hi Bednobs

To leave as much of your house to your children as you can,
That is why one spouse wills her to the children.

[bednobs]

i think all your friends and you are probably an exception - i would hazard a guess that the majority of people who buy a house nowadays buy it as joint tenants, rather than tenants in common? Although this is only a guess obviously, because i have no idea really. Perhaps the fact that your mum was fairly elderly (and i guess your friends parents are probably about the same age) has a bearing on it? Perhaps it was more usual in those days to hold house ownership as tenants in common?

[Hastler]

Hi Bednobs

My parents owned their house jointly but split their ownership to tennants in common in the mid 80's.
My husband and myself have always been tennants in common.

[Ann]

Can you leave part of the house "in trust" for your children? I have read that you can do this with your bank savings to avoid all savings being taken for care home fees as well as the sale of the house. How much can you put "in trust" out of your savings?

[factor-fiction]

There are lots of threads on AB about "tennants (sic) in common" which I'm going to have to study because it's a topic I know nothing about and maybe I'm missing out on something.
Can anyone tell me how do I found out the basis on which my wife and I own a house?
http://www.theanswerb...ennants%2Bin%2Bcommon

[Hastler]

Hi factor30

I think this link may be helpful.

http://www.land-registryuk.org/

It may be worth contacting the land registry before ordering any copy documents but it is shown we are Tennants in Common in equal shares on our land certificate.
You may have a copy of your land certificate in your bank.

Alternatively phone [phone] for advice.
This is the Coventry office for advice but they should be able to tell you where your local office is.

My fathers land certificate is in a different format to ours as his property is older.

[Hastler]

Hi Ann86

I would see a solicitor.
If the trust is set up to avoid care fees it can be set aside by Social Services however long ago it was made.

[beegeebee]

I now understand why Government will not allow either euthanasia nor assisted suicide. They need to be able to get their hands on the value of the house and at the same time ensure the children aren't able to do away with their parents, should they become too ill to remain in their own home!!