Help....I'm Stuck!

[craft1948]

I am stuck trying to find details of my great-great-grandparents.
The only census I can find any mention of them together as a family is in the 1871 census when they are in York.......details as follows.
Daniel Lawler born c1829 Birmingham Shoemaker (my gggrandad who died in 1876)
Ann his wife born in Belfast (I can't tell from the 1871 census if she was 36 or 30 on the original transcript) On their daughter Ann's birth certificate she is shown as Ann Savage formerly known as Ryan.
Also on the census is Mary Lawler born c1861 in Newcastle, James Lawler born c1867 in Newcastle., and Annie Lawler (my great-grandma) born 1869 in York.
I cannot find any trace of them before 1871 including birth or marriage records, but think Ann may have been married before (hence the 2 names) and given the gap in the children's ages Mary, or indeed James, may not have been Daniel's child.
Daniel died in York in 1876 and I cannot find any trace of his widow or children on the 1881 census, my great-grandma only shows in the 1891 census after she had married my great-grandad.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, as I have looked at this so many times I'm completely lost.

[craft1948]

Thanks dot.......I got it to probably 30 by comparing other figures as well. Would love to know where they all disappeared to in the 1881 census....I can't even find my great-grandma Annie.

[dothawkes31]

Craft I've found a marriage entry in a parish register of owlerton? york in 1896 for annie lawler to J P Mcdonald, she was 27 he was 40 her father was daniel lawler , when you said they were on the 1891 did you mean 1901?

[craft1948]

dot my Annie Lawler married William Bellwood in 1886 in York.

[dothawkes31]

ahhh right, this annie lawler has a father daniel lawler and she is born 1869 but she marries near Sheffield. coincidence I guess.

anyway, I've just found John Daniel Lowlar (sic) on the 1891 census lodging at 6, St John Place , All saints Peasholm York, he is 19 a railway worker, and also lodging there is James Lowlar (sic) aged 23 also a railway worker, both born York.

[craft1948]

dot that is excellent.....so that is 2 of the brothers, but still nothing in 1881.

[dothawkes31]

It's definately a transcription/surname variation issue, plus in 1891 james (or someone else) gave his place of birth as York not Newcastle. Still nothing on the 1881 like you say.

[craft1948]

I've found them getting married now, and it looks like they married sisters from Bishop Wilton, Jane and Faith Beal....

[craft1948]

Dot I can't find John Daniel's birth registration to send off for a certificate.....

[dothawkes31]

Sorry I've been to pick son up from work. I did look for it after I found his baptism but it wasn't obvious. I'll keep looking, did you find the baptism?

[dothawkes31]

John Daniel is transcribed in the actuall GRO index and lawley, ref: Q3 1871 York 9d 10. I just went into the original image and looked at possibles.

[dothawkes31]

sorry, i meant 'as Lawley' how many flippin variations can one name have lol!

[dothawkes31]

John daniel Lawler died in York Q3 1935, they got his name right at last!

[craft1948]

Thanks dot.....I'll send off for his birth certificate.......I'm waiting for a copy of Annie's marriage certificate at the mo.

[craft1948]

Right dot, I've ordered John Daniel's and I've taken a punt at one for a James Lawlor born in Newcastle in 1871, I know he's put York in a couple of censuses but I can't find a corresponding birth in York. I'll have another look when I get all 3 certificates through. Thank you very much for your help so far.

[craft1948]

I've found James on the 1911 census and he's given his birthplace as Newcastle again.

[dothawkes31]

sz been t asdas! It lks like you'll be ok with that one then, you can put confirming details on the order can't you, they still take some fee, but it's that bit more expensive now , did you read my post the other day? My order for 2 death certs last week took just 5 days and I ordered them the saturday of the bank holiday weekend, so yours should be quite quick.

[craft1948]

Hope so dot.......the last couple of times I've waited about 3 weeks.

[dothawkes31]

Craft can you have a look at the 1881 census for a William Jewitt aged 50, a nail maker born Derbyshire but living in Dundas Street St Saviour York.

[craft1948]

Will do...........

[dothawkes31]

Ann Jowett (sic) is on the 1901 still in St Saviors, the daughter martha is now Martha Jowett born 1880 and there is another son Joseph aged 17, there is no John Daniel anywhere that matches the one in 1881. What do you think?