Language evolving or degenerating?

[Tups]

I've always been pedantic about getting the english language correct. I know that 'language' is an organic thing that, by it's very nature, evolves. Let's face it, we wouldn't like to be talking middle english to our friends! But where do you draw the line between evolving and degenerating? Do we give in to the abuse people make of apostrophes? Do we accept bad spelling caused by people's slovenly articulation? I love the variety of colloquialisms but should there be golden rules that we never break? Perhaps you have your own favourite words and phrases that are peculiar to your location? I have only taught english at junior school level and wouldn't purport to be an expert by any means, but I do love my mother tongue, with all its richness and I am fearful of its deterioration. What do you think?

[slinkycat]

Totally agree with you there Tups, I take it you read the press reports about some english professor who suggested that we demand too high a standard from our school children over spelling and grammar, and should let the language evolve so that such mistakes as "there" instead of "their" or even "they're", should become accepted! I'm all for informality on sites such as this, I use text abbreviations (when texting!) and I'm certainly no expert in grammar, but I do get cross with bad spelling and punctuation.......and have probably made loads of grammatical errors while writing this!

[THECORBYLOON]

When did English become english?

[Tups]

That's a moot point thecorbyloom. I was just trying to be 'modern' and write it that way! Just to show I'm not a fuddyduddy! Slinkycat, your english/English is perfect!

[slinkycat]

Well spotted Corby, you're ( not your, note) just the sort of pedant the English language needs :-)

[THECORBYLOON]

I do not claim to be an expert or a pedant but for someone who has "only taught english" to claim to be one is a wee bit odd to me.

[Tups]

When I used to write English reports, we were made to use a capital E for the subject title then use a lower case e when talking about someone's use of english. Perhaps a peculiarity of our head teacher (or would you rather, Head Teacher?). I did say I'm no expert and I think with the changes we are seeing and accepting these days, it's hard for anyone to be one.

[Tups]

Oh and tastymorsel, I agree with you about pc spelling. Damn those Americans!

[slinkycat]

By the way Tups, if you're interested in local phrases etc, there's a book "Talking for Britain" which is great to dip into, also I'd recommend the novel "Ella Minnow Pea", can't recall the authors name at the mo, but its about a very well educated society who suddenly find they are allowed to use less and less letters of the alphabet when they talk or write to each other!

[EngTeach]

I know that people on a site like this will use a more casual tone, and that typing errors occur, but there is a difference between a typo and butchering the language. Some pet peeves:

could of instead of could've/could have
the misuse of there/their/they're
misuse of apostrophes

[Ice.Maiden]

I agree with Tups and ET.
Languages DO evolve, but I think the degeneration of the written word's down to the use of text speech, abbreviations by folk who perhaps can't pronounce the initial words - and ignorance in general.
I laughed like a drain at ET's irritating examples.
"Could of, would of, hadn't of......" Grrrr!
It doesn't matter so much on sites like this, and, as with MSN, we all know that they have a keyboard language of their own - lol - but I just prefer to see things written properly when it comes to formal letters and such.

[terambulan]

".....I've always been pedantic about getting the english language correct. ........."

That doesn't sound right? Did you mean to say "I've always been pedantic about using the English language correctly"

Me too, it seems to be in-bred in me though I do 'lighten up' in fun.

I do abhor corrections on here.....but couldn't resist this time!

[slinkycat]

Ha ha! For the degeneration of the English language look no further than the posting in the law section (criminal) titled "can i get charged for ABH" sorry, couldn't resist, but they should be done for ABH to spelling, grammar etc etc!

[jno]

the language will change whether we like it or not. Spelling is already so out of sync with pronunciation that people find it difficult to cope - I know the difference between there, their and they're, but the fact is they are all pronounced exactly the same, so it's logical if people use the same spelling for all three, even if it's wrong. Logic is not something to be sniffed at; I wish there was more of it in the language.

My current pet peeve is underway, which should be two words; it seems to have come under the influence of words like motorway and undertake (and such parallels do influence the way words are spelt). But in 20 years I expect underway to be normal and 'correct'.

[jake-the-peg]

There is no such thing as "correct English".

We have "Fowler's common usage" not "Fowler's correct usage".

I'm sure that some people from the time of the King James' Bible would think our language has degenerated because we don't use thee and thou and don't distinguish between singular and plural of what is now "you".

There is a risk but it's not that standards are falling in our eyes that people are using the language in different ways from the way we were taught was "right".

The risk is of fragmentation. Language is after all about communication. If it evolves differently in different communities in the UK then that communication will become impared.

Think about how hard it can be to understand a Glaswegian or Geordie. Now imagine dozens of different dialects.

I think we're a long way from that now after all we can still understand most Americans and Australians but it is more important than just worrying that people will do things differently from like what we was taught

[Tups]

lol!

Thanks for the book-reading ideas slinkycat; I'll look them up. Terambulan, I'm still working on your suggested correction ...!

[fatlil]

I can't understand the person who says accept different spellings in English. Would they accept different answers in other subjects such as Maths e.g. One and One make Three. Of course not because it is incorrect. Why should we as English teachers accept inaccuracies in our subject.

[Ethel]

I can't understand why there is so much difficulty with common English words nowadays - they are the same words with the same spellings as when I was a child; grammar and punctuation are the same.

I left school at 14 able to cope with it all.

[B00]

I too am slightly concerned over English teachers being unconcerned about spellin mistake in childrens' work. I know this is true as my eldest daughter still can't spell for toffee and we were told this whenever we contacted school about this concern.

Are we soon going to have a generations who spell words differently? How confusing will that become?