"Do I work in a70's sitcom?"

[jamesy boy]

In the office where I work, one of the managers regularly takes cat-naps while sat on the toilet.One of his staff is regularly drunk at work, and often leaves his desk to drink alcohol outside.This is common knowledge (I have witnessed these events first hand), and yet a blind eye is turned by other managers.Am I being unreasonable in thinking this is unacceptable?

[acw]

No you're not.  It is totally unacceptable.  The difficulty must be in knowing that it will probably continue.  Unless you inform a more senior manager, or one of the shareholders, nothing will change.  The problem with that is trying to retain anonymity so that you can remain comfortably in your job after the storm.   

I would hate to be in your situation, and you do have my sympathy!  The only thing I can thing of, is to start looking for other jobs.  Then, when you have something lined up make a sensible, yet public resignation, stating clearly to all your reasons for doing so. 

Good luck though.  I hope the situation somehow improves!

[undercovers]

yes you are, these people are your managers so have had to do the **** you now do to get to the position they are in - let them be and then one day you to can be drunk at work (as i am now) and sleep in the bog... or if you like change an organisation for the better and really succeed in what you and your company want. I really don't think its your place to question them unless they are threatening the business or you - just get back to work james and stop being a such a girl

[acw]

I bloomin hope you're joking undercovers.  Cos if I was ever in an office with a person with an attitude like that, I'd end up getting the sack - for trying to smack them one!  James - you still have my sympathy.  But are you reading our replies!?

[jamesy boy]

I am reading them,yes!

As for changing the organisation, well, the civil service is pretty unchangeable.Bring on the jobs cuts, I say!

[acw]

Ouch!  Your alternative then, may be to go to the papers and make a quick buck out of it... better still... threaten it and see what happens! :-)

[newtron]

I must say I kind of agree with undercovers.  From my experience, most offices are the same.  There are only one or two people who actually work and keep the wheels turning while the rest of the staff sits on their butts and does nothing.  The specific reasons for the lack of production from these individuals, whether it is being drunk or sleeping on the toilet is not important unless it presents a significant safety hazard.  Unfortunately, from your position you probably can't significantly change things.  So you should either deal with it or find a better job.  Sorry if that sounds harsh. 

[justineo]

I can totally sympathise jamesy boy, when I started work in the Civil Service, all the blokes, including their manager, would disappear at 11.30 down the pub and come back at 3.   There was one man, 3 grades above me, who was virtually unapproachable after lunch.  If you needed something authorising or some advice you had to ask him in the morning.  He was earning over 25000 pounds (sorry no pound sign).  I would suggest you go to your union but it's unlikely any major change would happen, in my experience.  If you're young enough try and find a more enjoyable job.

[acw]

But surely when someone is drunk that IS a safety hazard!?  Moreover, it's easier to prove than the lazy people who gossip too much or spend too much time making coffee etc. 

Anyway, since when did things become acceptable just because you can't change anything!?  It's still wrong!  It's like saying... well, I'm a teacher and I know the kids in my class have got a bag of E's in their bag, but if I confiscate them they'll just get them elsewhere, all kids are the same, so I'll leave it.  (Ok so it's not exactly like it, but it's still ignoring something that's wrong because the problem is widespread).  Here's a better one - letting people off for speeding because so many people exceed the limit.  It doesn't make it right!!

I don't wish people to change their opinions - everyone's entitled to their view.  I just find it worrying to think that there are people out there who enjoy carrying others for no particular reward.  Unless they're holding out for a reward in the "heaven" of their beliefs. 

[acw]

NB. I crossed posts with justineo and my last post was not a reaction to hers! :-)

[newtron]

acw, I'm not saying that it is acceptable because it cannot be changed or that it is OK because everyone is doing it.  That type of thing is not acceptble to me, so I went back to school and changed my career and hopefully, I can minimise the extent to which I have to deal with the type of behavior described above.  jamesy boy has two options, he can either accept it or not.  If he decides not to find it acceptable, then he can either find another job or try to change the way his current office works.  Obviously the latter is going to require great effort and may not be successful as suggested by justineo.  If he really likes his current job and feels like it is worth the effort, then he should go for it.  But if it's just a job that is not necessarily worth fighting for, then he should try to find another job.  It's great to want to change things for the better, but you need to prioritize you efforts.

[acw]

I'm not meaning to have a go Newtron - I just wanted to be clear that the "unreasonableness" of the situation and jamesy boy's options are not the same thing.  Ok, not explaining well!  What do I mean?  I mean that I just wanted to be clear that whilst we may feel that jamesy boy's options in reality may be put up or shut up (well, I mean leave or complain), whatever the options are, shouldn't influence our opinion about the reasonableness of the situation. 

Does that make any sense at all?

[newtron]

I understand what you are saying. As you said: everyone is entitled to their own opinions.  But in general, our opinions are meaningless if there is no action behind them.  In fact, I would say that almost everybody is guilty of "accepting" situations that by our opinion is  "unacceptable" precisely because we cannot easily change them.

[acw]

True true true newtron!

[DOG2004]

Any vacancies?

[Octavius]

The civil service has been operating that impoverished management style for years - why should it change now?

[LordyGeordie]

No advice as such, just intrigued as to what jamesy boy was doing when he witnessed his manager asleep on the bog first hand.

[jamesy boy]

lol! His snoring is audible from the urinals.I know it's him from footwear visible under the door.(i always check footwear so I can turn out the light on people I don't like, which probably makes me as much as a liability as anyone else in the office!)

[Octavius]

It would be far more entertaining to get a group of colleagues with spoons and saucepans, then creep up on the dozing cubical dweller, then let rip!

[joko]

maybe you do work in a 70's sitcom...and you are an entirely ficticious character! ...mmm...? ;)

[Amree]

I work in an office where 1 guy regularly takes days off sick, is on the internet most of the day and is just a dosser really. Last year he took 30 odd days off sick! But... he gets away with it. Some people just do. Again I don't think it's right. I'd like to know why some people can get away with behaving like that and others who actually go to work to work wouldn't stand a chance in hell.