Body & Soul7 mins ago
Are we heading for a Spring General Election?
20 Answers
All of a sudden some labour politicians are talking sense. Mr Woolas doesn't want a country full of imigrants, particularly non english speaking ones, Straw wants to tear up the HRA and Balls seems to have found some over Shoesmith.
Its all cobblers and hot air of course but is this the work of Mandy ?
Its all cobblers and hot air of course but is this the work of Mandy ?
Answers
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Spring election: No
Work of Peter Mandelson: Yes
The reason Woolas was talking exclusively to the Sun, and Straw to the Mail is part of Mandelson's master spin machine.
It was clear that Labour had lost its masterly media management that they had perfected so well under the Blair regime. In particular, the Labour message was not reaching people on the right of the political spectrum and that those two papers (and probably the Express) were getting too anti-Government and whipping their readers into the same frenzy.
By giving the papers exclusive interviews, they start to give the Government an easier time and the youngmafbog's of this world begin to calm down (and may won over again).
Work of Peter Mandelson: Yes
The reason Woolas was talking exclusively to the Sun, and Straw to the Mail is part of Mandelson's master spin machine.
It was clear that Labour had lost its masterly media management that they had perfected so well under the Blair regime. In particular, the Labour message was not reaching people on the right of the political spectrum and that those two papers (and probably the Express) were getting too anti-Government and whipping their readers into the same frenzy.
By giving the papers exclusive interviews, they start to give the Government an easier time and the youngmafbog's of this world begin to calm down (and may won over again).
YMB
Come on it's not the 80's a countries economy doesn't work like a persons bank balance!
Let's imagine we follow the Cameron plan:
Reduce spending and borrowing and cut NI.
Companies order books will fall and more people will be laid off from both public and private firms - He wants to cut NI but people aren't kept on if the order books are empty no matter what NI is!
High unemployment = low confidence = low consumer spending = low orders = Higher unemployment.
Classic viscious circle
Brown plan: (And much of the rest of the world!)
High borrowing and spending
Government spending keeps more businesses running and more people working. Unemployment lower =more confidence = more spending.
Repayments and taxes go up to pay for it in 2 years but at that time the economy is stronger and more able to repay it.
So the question is do you
A) Fancy keeping your job with higher taxes in 2 years
B) Fancy being unemployed for 4 years
Living in a low taxation country will do you little good if you don't have a job
Which is why most of the rest of the world including the US is siding with Brown and not Cameron
Incidently why is it Cameron and not Osbourne spelling out all this economic stuff on the news?
Or is that a dumb question?
Come on it's not the 80's a countries economy doesn't work like a persons bank balance!
Let's imagine we follow the Cameron plan:
Reduce spending and borrowing and cut NI.
Companies order books will fall and more people will be laid off from both public and private firms - He wants to cut NI but people aren't kept on if the order books are empty no matter what NI is!
High unemployment = low confidence = low consumer spending = low orders = Higher unemployment.
Classic viscious circle
Brown plan: (And much of the rest of the world!)
High borrowing and spending
Government spending keeps more businesses running and more people working. Unemployment lower =more confidence = more spending.
Repayments and taxes go up to pay for it in 2 years but at that time the economy is stronger and more able to repay it.
So the question is do you
A) Fancy keeping your job with higher taxes in 2 years
B) Fancy being unemployed for 4 years
Living in a low taxation country will do you little good if you don't have a job
Which is why most of the rest of the world including the US is siding with Brown and not Cameron
Incidently why is it Cameron and not Osbourne spelling out all this economic stuff on the news?
Or is that a dumb question?
Jake...hope your correct.
Could be in 2yrs time unemployment over 3million and the economic forecasts are wrong (as many economists suggest) and unable to repay what we will owe which will be 50% of GDP
Keep your fingers crossed Jake.
High taxation will drive the entrepreneurs abroad, just the sort of people we will need to give the economy a boost.
Could be in 2yrs time unemployment over 3million and the economic forecasts are wrong (as many economists suggest) and unable to repay what we will owe which will be 50% of GDP
Keep your fingers crossed Jake.
High taxation will drive the entrepreneurs abroad, just the sort of people we will need to give the economy a boost.
What's your alternative squad?
Do nothing? we know what that will do!
Besides which the top entreprenneurs of which you speak have numerous ways of avoiding taxation - many of the wealthiest do special deals with HM Government.
I'm afraid they don't pay the same taxes that you and I do!
No you and I will be paying for this.
But as I said - would you rather have a higher tax burden and? a job or sit listening to Cameron's crowd of old Etonians telling you to get on your bike and look for work like Norman Tebbit used to?
This is why Brown's popularity is rising - people can See that the Cameron Plan is "fiddling while Rome Burns"
I do have to confess that I prefer the Liberal Democrat plan (No tax cuts increased borrowing and increased public spending) but that's a minor detail
Do nothing? we know what that will do!
Besides which the top entreprenneurs of which you speak have numerous ways of avoiding taxation - many of the wealthiest do special deals with HM Government.
I'm afraid they don't pay the same taxes that you and I do!
No you and I will be paying for this.
But as I said - would you rather have a higher tax burden and? a job or sit listening to Cameron's crowd of old Etonians telling you to get on your bike and look for work like Norman Tebbit used to?
This is why Brown's popularity is rising - people can See that the Cameron Plan is "fiddling while Rome Burns"
I do have to confess that I prefer the Liberal Democrat plan (No tax cuts increased borrowing and increased public spending) but that's a minor detail
Jake, you are undoubtedly an intelligent man who puts his political views over very well, BUT they are spoilt by this obssesive and at times vitriolic atacks on Eton, Old Etonians, public shoolboys and "posh" people.
These people cannot help being born into a priveliged life and had no choice in embarking on a scholastic life at Eton or any other Public school. They cannot help the way they talk.
Give us all a break Jake and keep your relevant and well developed opinions to the subject.
P.S NO I didn't go to a Public School
These people cannot help being born into a priveliged life and had no choice in embarking on a scholastic life at Eton or any other Public school. They cannot help the way they talk.
Give us all a break Jake and keep your relevant and well developed opinions to the subject.
P.S NO I didn't go to a Public School
Thing is squad I did go to a public school although not one as posh as Eton.
I only really ever got to see and meet a small section of society and that influenced my views.
When I went to college I actually met a proper cross section of society and that changed me.
Later on I spent quite a lot of time associated with Oxford University and it became clear to me how different I'd have been if I'd have gone straight there from school.
Cameron has more old Etonians in his shadow cabinet than anybody for years. He and others were all members of Oxfords Bullingdon club that specialises in wrecking restaurants for a laugh ( then they pay for the repairs - you have to be very rich)
Tell me how a bunch brought up in that environment can possibly know appreciate the perspective of the vast majority of British people.
This is not the politics of envy - this is real concern about Camerons fitness to occupy No 10.
I only really ever got to see and meet a small section of society and that influenced my views.
When I went to college I actually met a proper cross section of society and that changed me.
Later on I spent quite a lot of time associated with Oxford University and it became clear to me how different I'd have been if I'd have gone straight there from school.
Cameron has more old Etonians in his shadow cabinet than anybody for years. He and others were all members of Oxfords Bullingdon club that specialises in wrecking restaurants for a laugh ( then they pay for the repairs - you have to be very rich)
Tell me how a bunch brought up in that environment can possibly know appreciate the perspective of the vast majority of British people.
This is not the politics of envy - this is real concern about Camerons fitness to occupy No 10.
Well Jake, I did it the OTHER way brought up in a working class family, scholarship to Grammar School and then |University where I met other boys who had priveliged schooling and this changed my view of the world.
Look at the Labour Front Bench and it is riddled with Public School boys....same argument as yours.....what do they know about the working classes. Dianne Abbott, Tony Blair couldn't wait to get there children to fee paying schools.
A doctor doesn't have to personally experience e.g cholera, before he realises the implications.
Look at the Labour Front Bench and it is riddled with Public School boys....same argument as yours.....what do they know about the working classes. Dianne Abbott, Tony Blair couldn't wait to get there children to fee paying schools.
A doctor doesn't have to personally experience e.g cholera, before he realises the implications.
Strange how Cameron is crying like a baby. He foresees the economy in dire straights if he gets elected in 2010 with massive borrowing to pay back under his watch.
But just look back to when Labour first got elected in 1997. The country was saddled with a huge deficiit of about �28 billion which landed in Labour's lap. The first 3 years when Brown was named the iron chancellor for his belt tightening and shrewness in getting the economy on an even keel and we all suffered during this period.
Maybe there's a real reason for the country spending now just as we run up credit card debts to see us through.
But just look back to when Labour first got elected in 1997. The country was saddled with a huge deficiit of about �28 billion which landed in Labour's lap. The first 3 years when Brown was named the iron chancellor for his belt tightening and shrewness in getting the economy on an even keel and we all suffered during this period.
Maybe there's a real reason for the country spending now just as we run up credit card debts to see us through.
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