garden nudity

[Hugh Spencer]

The July before last I was watering my garden with a hosepipe when my loose-fitting shorts dropped to the ground and my neighbour complained to the police who reprimanded me. Has there been change in the law whereby if you are in your own garden, secluded from passersby and not being provocative to any prying neighbours, you can strip if you want to?

[Postdog]

I didn't know there was a law as such, but do you realise you are contradicting yourself. You say "secluded from passers by" and "prying neighbours" and yet the fact that you were seen flashing (OK, accidentally maybe) proves that you are neither secluded or away from where neighbours can see.

[Ethel]

If your garden is overlooked by your neighbours going about their own business and not resorting to standing on ladders or leaning out of windows - you cannot expose your bits in the garden.

I find it hard to believe that a neighbour would call the police in the circumstances you describe. It would be natural to attempt to cover oneself if clothing went adrift - surely you did?

This is a useful link for you:

http://n-2.org.uk/nuff/pages/legal/garden.htm

Remember - if your neighbour could easily see your genitals in that fleeting moment (I hope it was fleeting) then perhaps a child could.

[Solarjunkie]

I always understood that nudity is not illegal, only if it "intends to shock" as in dirty-mac type flashing.

Personally I've never understood the fuss - we all have bodies!

[kempie]

The Sexual Offences Act 2003 created a new offence of "Exposure" which replaced several archaic "Indecent Exposure" offences. One criterion of the new offence is supposed to be "intend to cause alarm or distress" however a conviction for Exposure is possible even in cases where there is no actual victim and where no-one was caused "alarm or distress".

http://n-2.org.uk/nuff/pages/legal/soa.htm

[Hugh Spencer]

Well now, Kempie, going to the website you included in your reply, ' there is legal consensus in Section 66 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003 that it does not criminalise nude sunbathing where there is no sexual activity and that it cannot be used against genuine naturists'.

[kempie]

I read the page (and others) before posting the link and am well aware of the full text and its meaning.

I repeated the line "...conviction ...is possible" (note it does not say "is likely") to highlight the fact that, such as with other legislation, it is not always the letter of the law that directs the outcome of a prosecution.

[Yorkie580]

What exactly do you mean by reprimanded? Dis you get arrested?

[Ethel]

It's a shame your neighbour didn't see the funny side - laugh, point and say 'Don't get worrying about such a little thing'

[Hugh Spencer]

Hi Yorkie,
A female neighbourhood police officer accompanied by a recruit came and told me that a complaint had been made, advised me to keep my 'knickers' on. I went next door to discuss the matter and the door was shut in my face, she must have complained again so the next visit by the officer was to advise me to let the matter drop. We weren't on good terms with the neighbours before but now there is little chance of improvement.

[seatrout]

I'm not surprised the Police reprimanded you. Your story may well be the one in a 1000 thats true but quite honestly ill fitting shorts/trousers/swim suits is a favourite excuse of the serial flasher. Buy some knicker elastic if its a problem then your neighbour wont have to worry

[Hugh Spencer]

OK Seatrout,
I can see you are prejudiced from the start. I wouldn't have raised the subject if I was what you are hinting at. You are prepared to condemn somebody out of hand but I hope your relations with people in everyday matters are better than the impression you are giving.

[buildersmate]

Maybe that's why he's called Seatrout.

[Yorkie580]

Cards on the table... I'm a police officer.

I don't know whether you're innocent or not and I'm not going to pass specific comment.

On-going neighbour disputes are extremely difficult. They get referred to the police because none of the other Emergency Services would deal with them - they don't involve rescuing/saving people so they must be a police problem, and councils don�t work 24hrs.

Assuming innocence...

It sounds like your neighbour complained and somebody came round to speak to everyone.

Imagine the call to the Control Room - "my neighbour's flashing at me". It would have to get a response.

The officers/community officers have probably spoken to your neighbour and come round to warn you that the person next door can see you and it caused them offence.

It means that the neighbour is told that you've been spoken to, and it means that you've been made aware that they were unhappy.

Unfortunately common sense rarely applies anymore. The laws are getting more and more ridiculous as the government desperately tries to rectify mistakes made previously.... ASBOs for example are a reaction to public outcry at the courts not doing anything about disorder, yet if the government hadn't weakened sentencing powers of magistrates and judges and hadn't run away in fear from the Human Rights Act, ASBOs wouldn't have been needed.

Because everyone's scared of complaints (Senior Management would rather reprimand their own staff even if they've done the right thing, rather than risk a complaint themselves) action is taken more and more regularly in order to cover oneself. Not always right, and certainly not what most police officers want.

[Hugh Spencer]

Thank you Yorkie,
I have been hoping that someone from the Police force or a solicitor would contribute to this discussion. One thing I did not mention in my original contribution was that the neighbour had erected a 6 foot fence on her side and the only way she could have seen me was from the upstairs window. The telling comment you made was - 'common sense does not apply anymore'. In years gone by I imagine that the phone call would be made, the complainant would be assured that no harm was being done and certainly no officer would be sent round. Nowadays the public do not know where they stand in many issues and I regret to see that the government have a lot to answer for to the detriment of relations with the local police force. Thanks.

[Nether Edge]

Hugh's answer reminds me of the old joke. Lady complains re neighbour's nudity; PC attends her house to inspect and says "I can't see anythging, madam. Surely you're mistaken?"; and she replies "But you CAN see him next door, if you stand on top of the bedroom wardrobe and twist your neck through 75 degrees."