Computers1 min ago
Right of way
14 Answers
I was a part owner (3 partners) in a freehold shop (1) with a flat above, access was through the shop.
We bought the land next door and built a shop (2) and flat above, givening it its own separate access between the two properties.
We then removed the stairs from the first flat to give more room at the rear of the shop (1) and knocked a doorway through to the staircase servicing the flat over shop (2).
When dad died we split the freehold of the 2 shops and flats having one each, brother had shop (1) and I had shop (2).
I retired keeping freehold shop & flat (2).
My brother has now sold shop & flat (1).
Has the new owner of (1) any right to use the stairs which I own the freehold of and have never given a verbal or written authorisation to use.
thanks for any help.
We bought the land next door and built a shop (2) and flat above, givening it its own separate access between the two properties.
We then removed the stairs from the first flat to give more room at the rear of the shop (1) and knocked a doorway through to the staircase servicing the flat over shop (2).
When dad died we split the freehold of the 2 shops and flats having one each, brother had shop (1) and I had shop (2).
I retired keeping freehold shop & flat (2).
My brother has now sold shop & flat (1).
Has the new owner of (1) any right to use the stairs which I own the freehold of and have never given a verbal or written authorisation to use.
thanks for any help.
Answers
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I'm surprised this was not sorted out when the freehold was split. I assume from what you say that the stairs are included in the freehold of shop & flat 2. There should be something in the title deeds of shop & flat 1 giving a right of way to use the stairs for access to flat 1. If there is not, and you want to be awkward about it, then the new owner would probably have to take you to Court where I hope a judge would decide in his favour unless you have some very good reason for refusing to grant a right.
As joint freeholders you wouldn't have needed a prow between your own properties.
I too am supprised that the row issue wasn't picked up by the purchasers solicitor. Which would have been added to yours and the purchasers deeds.
If there is only access through the shared access then how would you propose the other flat obtained access?
Anyway shared access in flats doesn't tend to be a problem otherwise all the blocks ever made would be in termoil!
I would be inclined, for an easy life, to grant either joint ownership of the access or roa with a 50% of maintanance cost clause.
Does the other flat owner know he doesn't have official row/a? You could ask him for a % of the costs involved in getting this sorted though.
I too am supprised that the row issue wasn't picked up by the purchasers solicitor. Which would have been added to yours and the purchasers deeds.
If there is only access through the shared access then how would you propose the other flat obtained access?
Anyway shared access in flats doesn't tend to be a problem otherwise all the blocks ever made would be in termoil!
I would be inclined, for an easy life, to grant either joint ownership of the access or roa with a 50% of maintanance cost clause.
Does the other flat owner know he doesn't have official row/a? You could ask him for a % of the costs involved in getting this sorted though.
I thought I did.
Please explain better where I have not understood.
You owned one proerty. Built second property with a link to first.
Jointly owning the two properties you do not need a row.
First property was sold (incredibly) with no row to his property?
You now worry about selling second property.
What is not to understand?
Please explain better where I have not understood.
You owned one proerty. Built second property with a link to first.
Jointly owning the two properties you do not need a row.
First property was sold (incredibly) with no row to his property?
You now worry about selling second property.
What is not to understand?
The second property had no link with the first when it was built.
It was some years later that we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2. to give extra space in shop 1.
Then dad died, brother had first propert (1)solely, I had the new propert (2) which included the stairs solely having nothing to do with the ownership of propert (1).
I retired, keeping property (2).
Then brother sold property (1), brother never mentioned to the & buyer did not ask about the stair access, until I told him.
What if any are his rights to use them.
I have offered a short term lease to give him access, so I can sell it in the future with its own private entrance.
He fills he should have unrestricted access for ever.
It was some years later that we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2. to give extra space in shop 1.
Then dad died, brother had first propert (1)solely, I had the new propert (2) which included the stairs solely having nothing to do with the ownership of propert (1).
I retired, keeping property (2).
Then brother sold property (1), brother never mentioned to the & buyer did not ask about the stair access, until I told him.
What if any are his rights to use them.
I have offered a short term lease to give him access, so I can sell it in the future with its own private entrance.
He fills he should have unrestricted access for ever.
The second property had no link with the first when it was built.
It was some years later that we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2. to give extra space in shop 1.
Then dad died, brother had first propert (1)solely, I had the new propert (2) which included the stairs solely having nothing to do with the ownership of propert (1).
I retired, keeping property (2).
Then brother sold property (1), brother never mentioned to the & buyer did not ask about the stair access, until I told him.
What if any are his rights to use them.
I have offered a short term lease to give him access, so I can sell it in the future with its own private entrance.
He fills he should have unrestricted access for ever.
Does the other flat have access other than through the shared stairwell? If not then you would be a real @arse not to grant a permanent row. A court might see it that way as well!! And if your neighbour were to open a dispute over this it would have to be declared on the hips (or whatever it is) and would make it more difficult to sell with the row.
Your comment 'we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2' etc especialy if there is no other access gives the impression that access was granted! and that at the time both properties were under joint ownership by all brothers and father.
How long have the flats had the link? If no verbal agreement was made, depending on time scale, he may have a right to access now.
I cannot see a problem with it being a duel access for both flats! As said earlier shared entrances are not normaly a problem for flats unless you make it so.
Personaly I would expect unrestricted access as well.
What does your solicitor say?
It was some years later that we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2. to give extra space in shop 1.
Then dad died, brother had first propert (1)solely, I had the new propert (2) which included the stairs solely having nothing to do with the ownership of propert (1).
I retired, keeping property (2).
Then brother sold property (1), brother never mentioned to the & buyer did not ask about the stair access, until I told him.
What if any are his rights to use them.
I have offered a short term lease to give him access, so I can sell it in the future with its own private entrance.
He fills he should have unrestricted access for ever.
Does the other flat have access other than through the shared stairwell? If not then you would be a real @arse not to grant a permanent row. A court might see it that way as well!! And if your neighbour were to open a dispute over this it would have to be declared on the hips (or whatever it is) and would make it more difficult to sell with the row.
Your comment 'we knocked through to the stairwell of the property 2' etc especialy if there is no other access gives the impression that access was granted! and that at the time both properties were under joint ownership by all brothers and father.
How long have the flats had the link? If no verbal agreement was made, depending on time scale, he may have a right to access now.
I cannot see a problem with it being a duel access for both flats! As said earlier shared entrances are not normaly a problem for flats unless you make it so.
Personaly I would expect unrestricted access as well.
What does your solicitor say?
You took out their stairs. You took out the access via those stairs. You made an access throught the (now) joint stairwell. Then it would appear, to me at least, that you have given a row.
Who owns the shop below his flat?
Basicly don't be an @arse, give him access without restrictions (other than would be normal for a flat).
You made the access for the flat and blocked off all other routes. What the hell do you expect?
Who owns the shop below his flat?
Basicly don't be an @arse, give him access without restrictions (other than would be normal for a flat).
You made the access for the flat and blocked off all other routes. What the hell do you expect?
-- answer removed --
But you were responsible for the changes to the property in the first place. How can you now almost wash your hands of it and blame everyone else? How long has the property been sold?
Have you had a falling out with your brother or the new owner of next door? and/or are you just being a total pr!ck?
How can any descent person do what you have done with the access then start bleeting on about the others access? There must be more to this than what you have said.
Have you had a falling out with your brother or the new owner of next door? and/or are you just being a total pr!ck?
How can any descent person do what you have done with the access then start bleeting on about the others access? There must be more to this than what you have said.
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