Caution

[Mi4h]

I have a caution from 2003 for a public order act which I got from an Anti War protest for the following reason:
OFFENCE: USING THREATENING, ABUSIVE, INSULTING WORDS OR BEHAVIOUR W/I TO CAUSE FEAR OR PROVOCATION OF VIOLENCE ON MARCH 2003
PUBLIC ORDER ACT 1986 S4 (1) (A)

I was at an anti war protest organised by stop the war coalition, which I was not a member of. The protest was halted by the police so I decided to go home but I broke the police line and was arrested by the Police and then released. I attended court many times to plead my innocence but the court kept on adjourning the hearing. I was missing my project management University class every Monday morning. Frustrated, I decided to plead guilty as I was told by my Solicitors that I would get a caution and the caution would be cleared after two years of the offence.

I have now qualified as a Secondary School Teacher but I have now discovered that the caution still remains and comes up on my CRB. I am finding it very difficult to get a job because Head Teachers do not wan an employee with a criminal record. I spoke with the CRB team and they told me that this is a small offence and should not be a problem when working in Schools but Schools of course won’t take that in.

Apart from this incident I have never been in trouble with the police and this was an unfortunate incident and situation. I am not a violent or vicious person, in fact very friendly and warm. If I knew it would appear on my CRB and it would not clear after two years I would have tried my best to clear my name as I did not do any of the actions or say the words stated on the offence above. I am in a terrible situation as I worked really hard to pass my Teacher training. I am wondering if there is anyway to fight the record so it can be cleared. I would be very grateful if someone could please help or guide me in the right direction.

[kryptic]

I believe that if you havnt appealed your conviction within one month of sentence then there is nothing you can do. A similar thing happened to a friend of mine.

[sherrardk]

Could it be worth your while informing any potential emplyers that this will come up when they do a CRB check on you? They will then know what's what and can decide if they still wish to offer you a job?

[kryptic]

CRB checks make a mockery of the rehabilitation off offenders act as well. I have several convictions from when I was younger (including a prison sentence) that are technically 'spent' but when applying for jobs that require checks, i have been well and truly stuffed.
Despite having numerous qualifications I now whave to work as a driver/.labourer.
Mind numbing when I know that I could be so much more.

[Mi4h]

Hi, sherrardk

Unfortunately having a caution on a CRB is a big no no in Schools. I recently applied for a post and the Head Teacher really liked my application but decided not to take it further because of my caution. It’s like a scar on my application, I feel like taking the Solicitors to court for not telling me that it would not go of the PND and would appear on enhanced CRB checks.

[kryptic]

Mi4h, guess you didnt like my answer then?

[sherrardk]

Hi Mi4H - I am an ex-teacher and I was under the impression that it was just things on a CRB which showed that you were a risk to children that would effectively bar you from teaching. I just wondered if you could find a sympathetic Head/board of governors who could see the blip onyour CRB for what it is. Have you contacted your union for advice?

[Mi4h]

I appreciate your answer and am thankful but surely minor incidents should be erased after several years as some people completely change.

[Mi4h]

^^ to kryptic that is.

[Buenchico]

Up until October 2009 cautions COULD be removed from a person's record after 5 years but there was no compulsion upon police forces to actually do so. However a High Court ruling in that month now means that cautions remain on a person's record for life (or, if we're being really pedantic, to the person's 100th birthday).

While a Supreme Court ruling in November 2010 now means that senior police officers have to allow people to be able make representations about the possible disclosure of ADDITIONAL 'relevant' information under an enhanced CRB check, that doesn't change the rule that ALL cautions (other than those which were deleted prior to October 2009) will now appear on ANY CRB check (at either level).

Since the relevant police force chose not to delete the caution from your record prior to October 2009, it will now continue to appear on any CRB check. All that you can do is to be totally 'up front' about your brush with the law and to include a note about it with any job application which you submit. Having been a teacher myself (and the regional secretary for a teaching union) I know that many teachers have come into contact with the law without it totally 'screwing up' their careers. (i.e. if head teachers and, possibly more importantly, chairs of governors, are aware of such matters at an early stage they're likely to overlook them).

Chris

[kryptic]

Mi4h
http://forum.unlock.org.uk/default.aspx?c=1
People are asking similar questions here.
Good luck anyway.

[DTCwordfan]

find an employment lawyer - they may be able to reduce the effect of it - will cost you though but surely worth the initial consultation which should be free to gauge "the lie of the landscape."

[Mi4h]

No, now everything comes up even things that are not concerned with the welfare of children that happened years ago. My incident is no way related to children but appears on an enhanced CRB check. It’s very difficult to get to board level specially when there are 50 odd applicants because of the times we are living in. They can just choose someone else with a clean record. I will contact a union next week hopefully as it’s really getting me down. Thank you for your advice.

[RATTER15]

Isn't this why we have CRB checks done, to prevent unsuitable, untrustworthy people from being in positions that are not suitable.

If I was employing someone, I would rather know who I can trust in certain situations, A CRB is an indication of that. If you were looking after my children I wouldn't be happy knowing that you had been cautioned for USING THREATENING, ABUSIVE, INSULTING WORDS OR BEHAVIOUR W/I TO CAUSE FEAR OR PROVOCATION OF VIOLENCE.

Life can be hard, we all pay for our mistakes one way or another.

[sherrardk]

On the plus side, you have a degree so you should be able to get a job in a different sector (even if it's not one that you really want) some people don't have that kind of choice in life.

[RATTER15]

So you dont think "USING THREATENING, ABUSIVE, INSULTING WORDS OR BEHAVIOUR W/I TO CAUSE FEAR OR PROVOCATION OF VIOLENCE." could be a concern for someone looking to employ a head teacher?

[kryptic]

// On the plus side, you have a degree so you should be able to get a job in a different sector //
providing that you dont need a CRB check that is?
I know people with degrees that cant get a job because they have a record.
CRB checks obviously have there place but why disclose things that just arnt relevant to the job in question?

[Mi4h]

RATTER15 I understand your point but I did not actually commit that offence. I pleaded guilty firstly as I was missing my University classes in my final year. Secondly my Solicitors told me if I pleaded guilty I would get a caution and that would disappear after two years. I agreed to that as I was naïve and young at the time.

[Mi4h]

kryptic, funny thing is that I can work as a Supply Teacher and have been for the past year.

[kryptic]

the law is an ass mi4h

[New Judge]

Unfortunately by accepting the caution you have accepted guilt for the offence.