Why is racism always used in the Gypsy debate.

[Top totty]

I live about 2/3 miles from a peaceful permanent Gipsie caravan park. There are about 20 caravans that have been here for many years, all nicely kept and very private with no trouble. In the last few years a lot of gypsie/travellers (whatever term you want to use) have bought houses very near to this park and they have spent a fortune on the properties (about 15 in total)

They are all surrounded by high wrought iron gates with security lights in every corner and every drive has at least 2/3/4 large caravans on it where extented members of the family live. Since these families have arrived the crime rate has gone through the roof, the local shop is a no go area except for the very hardened few and the local Primary school has been taken over and no child is safe from the bullying and intimidation that takes place every day. The parents are no better than the children with threats of violence every day and total disregard for everyone but themselves with regard to parking etc. I have luckily got my children into a school 8 miles from my village to avoid them having to attend there. Local shops have all been targarated in one way or another and forget visiting the local pub/resturant as they take it over most weekends and spend the time fighting each other and wrecking the place.

There is not one aspect of village life that these people have not trampled all over. Their houses are beautifully kept and we are lucky in that respect as I have seen what can happen but I don't care what race or colour these people are I hate the way they have moved into this village and ruined the peace that we once had. I would not dare challenge them face to face for fear of what would happen to my own property as I was once warned my car would be fire bombed, a complaint to the police did not even get a response.

[natalie_1982]

In the town I used to live there was a village just outside where my grandparents live and the very same thing happened there.  In the town I worked in a bar and one night two of the male travellers had been drinking Stella since 10am and left their brand new reg plated BMW and Merc out the front with their kids in the back of one and wifes in the other.  Around about 7pm the wives come in fighting, then at closing we had called the police as they were so drunk they couldn't stand and were driving home with their kids in the car.  Even the local police (our local station happens to be head of Thames Valley) could only act as an escort as they knew if they'd tried arresting the men/ women or even stopped them from getting in the car the station would, at the very least, have been petrol bombed that very same night.

In the end, on of the local landlords had a word in the ear of the Old Man and he rounded his boys up gave them a stern 'telling off' (to grown men!) and advised us that if anything happened again then to contact him direct.

Needless to say, I don't miss the area at all.

[luckyboy]

First of all lets get one thing right these people are not gypsies they are travellers which is a important distinction, gypsies have a rich and respectful culture which should be cherished not derided .

Bad behavour by travellers is nothing new, its been going on for years, my old man has told me similar stories that originated 30 years ago, the point is what is the answer, its no good people bleating about this government being soft, when the act that caused some of this current problem was enacted by the last tory government, governments of both political persuassions can be faulted.  call me cynical but can this current daily mail campaign have anything to do with a general election in the offing, where politicians promise us they have the answer elect them, been around the block long enough to suss out a populist vote grabber issue when i see one.

This story will dissappear as soon as the election is over, not for the people who have to put up with the problem however. but the politicians would have got their vote by then..

[jake-the-peg]

There's a bunch of families in my area who are basically trouble on a stick - came to a head recently when somebody got assaulted with a hammer!

Thing is they're not travellers or gypsies they've been in the area for generations - had they been travellers it'd be all over the national press.

We have planning legislation we have Anti-Social Behaviour Orders (ASBOs) - we don't need more laws, we need the enforcement of the ones we have against mobile and stationary thugs.

[Avenches]

I think you should get a group of at least 20 households together and write a joint letter to the chief constable listing your actions so far and the helplessness of the local police. Next write to your MP, next get the press interested with your list of completed actions. Nobody should have to live in fear of bad neighbours. Finally save up some money and get some thugs in from out of town and burn them out.

[El D]

damn straight these people are anti-social parasites. I don't care what their culture is if it impacts negatively on the local area they either cannot stay or should be locked up. They have absolutely no regard for anyone else or other people's property. I have never heard of a positive experience with travellers.

[littleoldme]

luckyboy has beaten me to it - it's about time someone spoke out to distinguish between genuine gypsies and itinerant travellers - shame the press rarely do.

We've had a small encampment of "genuine" gypsies living about a mile away for years now, and they have never - and I mean, never - been any trouble at all. They keep themselves pretty much to themselves, but when they do come into contact with others, they are perfectly decent charming people - "rough diamonds" maybe, but not out to cause trouble or be anti-social in any way.

Most of the troublemakers are nothing to do with gypsies - they hang on to that tag to make themselves seem more valid and claim discrimination against their "culture" (i.e. getting drunk, having street races and intimidating locals) if anyone dares to speak out. I know of one "extended" (i.e. inbred) family a few miles further away who are the scourge of every pub landlord and betting shop manager in the area. Utter scum. Human rights? What about the rights of people lucky enough to live in a decent neighbourhood to continue living in a decent neighbourhood? What about the rights of people to go about their business without feeling intimidated?

As for racism, how can it be? They're not of a different race. Different species, maybe. Huff. Rant over.

[QmunkE]

Traveller parents who prevent their children going to school (clearly this does happen, and in a lot of cases. I've seen them myself) should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I'd like to try and see them hide behind the Human Rights Act when they are denying their children access to education.

[FP]

I totally agree with ElD.  I live in an area of Norfolk which has a traveller problem.  A local village is well known for it's pilgrimages and every year the travellers turn up.  The village has to board up it's shops and people have to lock away all their garden furniture, etc.  For the last two years they have left the most obnoxious rubbish  all over their site, including several dead dogs in bin bags!

They even have special people employed by the Education Authority to help their children in school - I had no help offered for my dyslexic son! 

What do they give to society?  Nothing.

The police won't touch them - they are afraid of them!!

[FP]

My rant is aimed at 'travellers', not gypsies. 

[Dom Tuk]

But we live in a society where to say anything against a minority even though the statemenst are completely true and warranted is considered racist. I am not white anglo saxon, and I am not racist. But if i think that uncontrolled immigration is ludicrous, i am called racist. similarly to ask questions about travellers and the free reign that they have in this land to do what they like an where they like is enough to get liberal knickers in a right twist.

[milly143]

It's no wonder that cousils and people that live in the areas do not want permanent travellers sites. I had experience with travellers in my old town and pretty much the same thing, just causing lots of trouble and ruining everything they could get there hands on. I recently watched a program about a group of travellers who were really moaning because they were always being evicted from camp sites and one mother in particular was saying how her children were bullied at school (the ones that went) because of how much they travelled around but you just had to look at their behaviour to see why they were moved. It just wasn't possible to have any sympathy for them.

[Top totty]

Seems I am not the only one with obnoxious neighbours then.

I truely hate these people, they just seem to trample over everything nice and decent. I have had a few run ins with them and been met with abuse and threats, one 'child' told me that they live off the backs of people like me !!!!!!! I wonder what the do-gooders would make of that if they heard it. I wish the people that defend them and their actions were made to go and live near them for 48 hours and then see if their opinions were the same. ??  

 

If they are travellers then why don't they do a bit of travelling and move on. 

[luckyboy]

To get it back to the issue at hand..

It seems to be conveniently forgotten by most people that it was michael howard himself as home secretary in 1994 who curtailed the ability of local authorities to deal sensibly with travellers sites... 

[Fern57]

I think we should be aware that there are good and bad amongst all. Three weeks ago a travellers camp has been set up about 50 yards from my friend's flat. They are right next to the bus stop. Yesterday she (my friend) got off the bus with 6 bags of shopping. Seeing that she was struggling a bit, one of the travellers offered to help her with the heavy load. He was very polite. There are black bin bags outside their caravans ready to be either picked up by the local bin-men and the site looks relatively tidy still. I am not Pro-Travellers by any means. They make a mess of our countryside and the crime rate increases whenever they move into the area. Most of them do work (Rogue Traders maybe, but at least they're not sitting on their backsides doing nothing).

A year and a half ago my son married an Irish Traveller. I was not happy about it at all. I didn't even want to get to know her, and I refused to go to the wedding (something I later regretted). But she has turned out to be probably the best thing that has happened to him. She keeps the house tidy, makes sure his dinner is on the table every night, and shows a lot of respect for all our family. I had three sons, and if there was ever a 'perfect daughter-in-law' she definitely fits the bill.
They were in the local pub last night and one of the regulars (NOT a traveller) started a fight - because she had an Irish accent! So who are the ones who are a bunch of trouble-makers here?

[skyelab]

I think avenches is going a bit over the top with the burn them out bit, this could be racial haterd and I dont think that sort comments should be on answerbank

[MunkeyBoy]

There is a travellers site a stones throw from my house and has been there since I moved in (16 years ago now)as a child I had numerous run-ins with them. I was once hit over the head from behind with a car battery, in an apparent mistaken identity, the young lad that did this was never punished and I still have the scars to show for his troubles! So as you can tell I, like many other by the sound of this feel very stronly about this.

I am now worried that the whole thing is far to out of control to stop. I mean what is the answer? The law will not just change over night and even if it does will we ever be satisfied with how it changes? It looks like this will unfortunatly never go away.

Unless the good, law abiding people of this great country stand up and unite and drive these SCUM out of our society. All we need one person to start a campaign and actually DO something about these people. Maybe someone should start a website for people to express there views and make some suggestions on the problem- I guarentee it will get alot of hits.

Just a thought! My appologise for my strong views I just feel very strongly about this subject (also appologise for VERY bad spelling throughout- this was a little rushed as I was on a roll!)

[tali122]

have you seen some of the flash motors these travellers drive?- most recent was a bentley continental gt(112000k)