Is This Theft ?

[chrissa1]

We are in dispute with a young man concerning �18,000.00 he has invoiced us for his time spent abroad with my husband on business in Dubai.
We paid for his flights, accommodation and expenses for the whole trip and at no point before they left, were we aware that he was going to make this charge. If we had known this, he wouldn't have been allowed on the plane!

He has told us he is taking us to court but took a month and a half to cash �3,500.00 that we paid him for a special camera he had bought for us. Why he took so long, we don't know

This camera was held in a warehouse belonging to a 3rd party near to us and we have just been told today that this chap drove up from Yorkshire and has taken our property away with him. We don't know why but we guess he is trying to use it as a lien against us.

My question is, is this theft and could we report it to the Police as such?

[Buenchico]

The guy might well have a defence against any charge of theft. He might argue that he didn't intend to permanently deprive you of the camera, or that he had a reasonable belief that he has a right to deprive you of it.

You know all of the circumstances, so I'll leave it up to you to decide whether his actions come within the legal definition of 'theft', which you can read here:
http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/content.aspx?LegT ype=All+Legislation&title=theft&Year=1968&sear chEnacted=0&extentMatchOnly=0&confersPower=0&b lanketAmendment=0&sortAlpha=0&TYPE=QS&PageNumb er=1&NavFrom=0&parentActiveTextDocId=1204238&A ctiveTextDocId=1204241&filesize=13471

Chris

[Barmaid]

What Chris says is right, but to add to that, I would suggest that if he pursues you in the civil courts, you should counterclaim for the cost of the camera or for damages.

[chrissa1]

Thank you for that both of you. Should I go to the Police to try to get the camera back? It is a very special camera for use in surveillance and monitoring.

[factor-fiction]

Maybe I'm missing something but I'm not sure why you think it is significant that he took so long to cash the �3500 you gave him?

[chrissa1]

We think there may have been a dispute between the 3rd party and this chap as we gave the cheque to the 3rd party but it was made out to the chap for delivery.
If you were given a cheque for �3.5K wouldn't you bank it straight away factor?? It's not really too important, just odd.

How do we get our property back?

[paraffin]

Section 1 (1) of the Theft Act 1968 gives the basic definition of theft as:

"A person shall be guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it."

However, from the details you have given, it sounds more likely that he may have committed burglary, as opposed to simple theft, given that you say that he apparently has taken property belonging to you from a warehouse belonging to a 3rd party.

Burglary is defined by S9 of the Theft Act 1968 as:

A person is guilty of burglary if he enters any building or part of a building as a trespasser with intent to steal, inflict grievous bodily harm (or raping any person therein, or do unlawful damage to the building or anything in it. S9(1)(a)

The crucial words re Burglary, as far as I can ascertain from your details, are "as a trespasser". Did he enter without 3rd party's knowledge/permission? That is something for you to consider. How did he get into the warehouse? Who owns that property?

There may be a theft, it may be burglary, or your suspect may have a defence in law that he was merely recovering part of the debt which he believes you owe him.

He clearly needs to be spoken to as does this 3rd party and whoever owns the warehouse / allowed your suspect to remove the camera.

Attend your local Police Station with as much detail as possible and they will be able to make a more informed judgement as the best way to proceed, since so many facts appear to be missing from your post.
Good luck.

[chrissa1]

Thanks paraffin for your comprehensive reply. This chap entered the warehouse and took the camera when the boss wasn't there and apparently "blagged it" to the young lads who were there, to remove the camera. They knew him, and didn't know Not to let him take it, and didn't ring their boss to check.

The camera does not form part of the debt as he has been paid for it and it belongs to us.

I think I Will go to our Police Station. Anymore advice out there would be very welcome. Cheers.

[paraffin]

Hi chrissa:

From your latest reply it seems quite clear to me that a burglary has occurred at the warehouse.

Good luck.

[scotman]

Not legally qualified but surely this all hinges on the contract you had with this person for his services on the trip

[gentleman]

In this case, the Owner of the warehouse is liable for his/her employee's actions. Make this quite clear to the Owner with a Solicitor's letter and you now seek compensation from the warehouse Owner failing which you can sue this in a small claims court or your solicitor can request all costs are covered in the compensation