Peugeot 205 with brake problem

[alavahalf]

I have just driven a peugeot 205 diesel...the brakes seemed dangerous.
When applying the brake, the pedal goes quite soft and it almost seems like the pads are down to the metal.
I have checked the pads and they are ok..
The hand brake works fine, so I can only expect the rear shoes are ok.
The brake fluid is at the upper level in the resevior.
Have checked all round and there is no sign of fluid leaking at the joints.
Should I try bleeding the system...can't see how air could have got in though.
Could it be the servo...how do you test a servo ?
Any help would be most appreciated.

[TWR]

Hi, you say you have checked for leaks!! did you check if the back plates are dry? & was the weather dry when you done this? Have you just replaced any pads ? if so did you undo the nipple? If no to the above try, as you say bleeding the system starting from the rear N/S rear Off.S rear --Front N/S Front Off /S, check all the belled nipples, check the top of the foot brake inside the car for fluid seepage, if wet brake Cylinder. If dry, Servo, job can be done within an hour, Inside the Servo there is a large Diaphram + spring + your brake cylinder, the Diaphram do wear but not that often.

[TWR]

Also, check the pipes to the servo from the inlet man, are the connections tight?

[alavahalf]

Thanks for that...just did'nt know about doing the servo.
Checked all joints in the dry...and theres no sign of fluid leaking anywhere..
Will now check pedal and vacum pipes.

[chas2008]

to test the servo-
with the engine off the brake is pressed repeatedly until the pedal goes hard, now with foot pressure applied to the pedal the engine is started and if the servo is functioning the pedal will drop slightly.

To check m/cylinder-

Depress the brake pedal and check that it does not creep down to the floor, indicating a master cylinder fault. Release the pedal, wait a few seconds, then depress it again. If the pedal travels nearly to the floor before firm resistance is felt, brake adjustment or repair is necessary. If the pedal feels spongy, there is air in the hydraulic system which must be removed by bleeding.

[alavahalf]

Have now checked vacum pipe.. it is secure and has hose clips fastening it in place.

Pumped brake pedal until it went hard...started engine and it dropped to about half way, and still seemed fairly hard.

With engine off...pressed pedal..seems to go half way down..but no further..pressed again with same result ...goes down half way and rests.
Does that mean the master cylinder is ok.

[chas2008]

not certain but being diesel it is probably fitted with a brake vacuum pump...

[wallis1007]

Have you checked the flexible brake hoses. These sometimes weaken with age. When pressurised the hoses expand rather then allow the fluid pressurise the brakes.

[TWR]

As stupid as this sounds, press down the brake pedal & hold can you hear a hiss? if so, Servo leak, something tell me there is air in the system, go around ALL the bleed nipples USE THE RIGHT SIZE SPANNER & try for tightness, if all ok, check the flexi pipes that they are not kinked, if OK, Look at the back of the servo where it inserts into the bulkhead, can you see any signs of wetness? If you do not need to top up the fluid, Again I would say that there is air in the system.

[TWR]

To the Tighness of the Bleed nipples, go carefull with these DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THEY WILL SNAP.

[Mavis22]

Might be worth flushing through and bleeding the system with fresh fluid.

[alavahalf]

I've checked the pipes and hoses all round...no leaks are visible.
The car is not available again until the weekend....so I will keep you posted....I think I will start by checking those flexi pipes under pressure. I think they are ok as the car has just had an mot recently...I will also change the fluid as this should flush out any air.
Thanks for all the answers..it does'nt seem half as bad with many heads thinking about it..

[alavahalf]

Your right..it's not my car.It has been a few months since I drove this car....
But I am not unfamiliar with a 205...last year I gave away a 205 that I had driven from new..it had 350,000 miles on it...so I am familiar of what the brakes should feel like.
I am now told that it was ok for the mot...but has'nt been used a great deal since...and it is in this period that the fault has developed.
The down to the metal feeling is when you apply the brake, ..it's almost like the brakes fading.The car seems to run on much further than I would want to.
So yes the car does stop...but not without applying more pressure than I would expect.
Anyhow it will hopefully be available at the weekend...then we will have another go.
Armed with the latest info, I think I will see if those caliper pistons are free.

[chas2008]

after what you just said it does sound like siezed/sticking calipers with a combination of rusty discs , the other possibility is if it has been fitted with new pads recently with too hard a material that would give a similiar result

[alavahalf]

Problem solved.....it was the front callipers sticking...we have removed the pads..applied a little pressure to the brake pedal, to make the pistons stick out...polished them up a little..fitted new pads.
Now the brakes seem fine....

Believe it or not, feeling all pleased with our brake problem solved...the next thing ... the clutch cable snapped.

Cars.....dont you just love them..

Anyhow ...thanks to everyone for your replies and interest shown.