Is the front page of the express correct?

[BrainsTracy]

Do most want out of the EU? How would you vote in a referendum?

[jno]

so how often would you like a referendum, em? Just keep having them until you get the result you want? Once a year? Every time a poll produces a different result from the last poll? What?

[emmie]

isn't that what they did in Ireland?

[jno]

never mind Ireland, what do you think should be done here?

Bear in mind Cameron has confirmed there will not be a referendum. I'd agree with him. Even if it found 51% wanted out, as the Express seems to be claiming without evidence, that wouldn't be enough foundation for rupturing the entire economic system - especially since another referendum a month later might take Britain back in again. It'd have to be something like a two-thirds majority, and there is none.

[emmie]

Seeing as how there won't be a referendum why be concerned. When Greece defaults, and that shouldn't be long now, and the euro looks like crashing, perhaps Britain can renegotiate terms.

[jno]

the euro and the EU aren't the same.

[starone]

I would vote to come out. They are of no use to us whatsoever. All they do is tell us what to do and drain money from us which we can ill afford. There are plenty of other countries out there waiting for our trade, as there was before we went in. I must confess I voted for in the first place because I had romantic ideas of a combine of countries. It hasn't worked out like that and I now think we should definitely come out. You only have to look at the euro to see what a disaster it is. Thank goodness we kept the pound or it might have been even worse. Please forgive the rant.

[DTCwordfan]

Well if you still want to rant starbuck, think what any of our governments do when they have money in the pot.....they pizz it away on foreign aid, stupid Arts projects (like the floating island for the Olympics arets festival - 1/4 million there), daft psychology projects and all the rest - and I am pointing the finger at all UK governments over the last 40 years or more. Give monkeys peanuts and all that - i.e. we should really go for a draconian cut of the number of MPs but up their salaries and attract some better minds - and more honest ones.

[shaneystar2]

There are plenty of other countries out there waiting for our trade ...
Which countries are they then ?
Perhaps we could trade them a cup of coffee .Because the service industry seems to be about all we have left here .

[starone]

Heavens above, DTcross, don't get me started - the older I get the more difficult it becomes to come to terms with it and all the wastage of our money that goes on.

[starone]

And to think we used to be called "the workshop of the world" shaney. Makes you want to weep doesn't it?

[shaneystar2]

Very true Starbuckone and all the more reason for staying with our European cousins to try and bolster trade of some description .
We simply can't go it alone .

[DTCwordfan]

shaney, we actually have a rich automotive sector - in high performance cars, motor-racing, componentry etc, then there's the biotech sector, renewables, IT sector etc, high-end precision industries, medicine and pharmaceutics, - I agree re the traditional industries but they would have been murdered anyway by the shift to low income economies (China, Korea, Vietnam and increasingly now Brazil), and those who put up heavy trade barriers or subsidies.....(e.g. China does it by keeping the RMB artificially low.....)

We do have more than you perhaps realise, not enough perhaps, but it is there and very different to the profile we were used to thirty years ago. That is perhaps the one major benefit coming out of Blairism (and I like many think that he was a prat), the way he went about encouraging new industry and inward investment was positive - and in keeping us out of (i) the Euro and (ii) some of the worst excessives of EU Labour law, and duly encouraged the Japs/Koreans/Americans/India to come in here, rather than some outpost of the European mainland.

[shaneystar2]

Don't patronise me DT.I've lived in a few countries in the EU .
I didn't come up the Thames in a bucket .

[giveup]

I think we should have a simple vote. In or Out. Then the people who could'nt be bothered to vote would only have themselves to blame if they did'nt get what they want. At the moment I am undecided but leaning towards Out.

[seadogg]

Some of our "European cousins" already own a large part of U.K. companies. Not saying that is always a bad thing as international capitalism works that way but it limits the effectiveness of mass opinion polls.

[emmie]

jno i didn't say it was. Nothing to be gained by prolonging these points, some believe we would be better out, and some better to stay in.

[bazwillrun]

"Bear in mind Cameron has confirmed there will not be a referendum"
because he know it would be a resounding no vote

when we originally joined it was as a trading community, or thats what we were told, but now people can see it for exactly what it is/was

an early part of the political masterplan to forge a superstate.

we are now suckered into it and are being destroyed by the day from brussels and the continuing compliance of our governments.

between the EU and mass immigration they will destroy this country and its culture and heritage, and we have politicians that have aided and abetted it for the past 40 or so years.

[emmie]

Bazwill, i totally agree, not the situation i like to think about, nor would my o/h who loved Britain, and would be horrified to see what's happened in the last few years.

[New Judge]

“but we are now embroiled in something i am sure politicians didn't envisage...”, (em10)”

Those who knew about these things most certainly did. The architects of the “European Project” had nothing but a Federation of European States in mind. They knew it would takei decades and they knew it could only be achieved by stealth, but they knew precisely what the ultimate aim was. And so did the Federalists of more recent times.

“...so how often would you like a referendum, em? Just keep having them until you get the result you want? Once a year?” (jno)

Perhaps. Just as in Ireland and Denmark

“...the euro and the EU aren't the same.” (jno)

No. But one was born out of the other. The Euro was a purely political project with no solid fiscal basis whatsoever (as is now evident). It was devised simply to further European integration.

The EU has changed beyond recognition since the referendum of 1975 (which was won courtesy of some highly dubious and misleading government propaganda). It assumes ever greater powers from the elected governments of the nation states – powers which the UK electorate has never been asked if it is happy to see relinquished. It is no use allowing politicians to decide the matter. Too many of them have personal vested interests in its continuation (some of them to such a degree that they would have to withdraw from the boardroom if it was a matter being decided by the Board of a company).

Any half-decent UK government would give their voters a say on the matter. But the trouble is we have not had a half decent government in the UK for some time.

And we certainly haven’t got one now.