prayers banned from council meetings....

[lcg]

any thoughts on this from my fellow abers? would be appreciated as mr kicker is writing for his MSc on religion and late modernity. some good discussion and other relevant links to this topic (and the op) would be gratefully received. mtia x

http://www.bbc.co.uk/...ngland-devon-16995239

http://www.bbc.co.uk/...ngland-devon-16980025

[lcg]

i have specifically posted this in news as it is a current affairs story. i am aware that there is a thread in the religion section (posted off to mr kicker already), but what i am looking for is links to religion and marginalisation: anywhere in the world and not just the christian faith. how religion is creeping away from sections of society and daily life is the kind of stuff we are after. thanks x

[RATTER15]

http://www.theanswerb.../Question1104396.html

[ummmm]

Lol Ratter....she already has that one :-) x

[jomifl]

I can't think of anything to add...

[NOX]

I think answers in the previous thread covered what you are looking for lcg.

[RATTER15]

ummm, how do you know that?

[Gromit]

A town council has specific duties to perform for the voters. But praying to an imaginar being is not one of them. Their time should be better used, tackling local problems. If any councillors need to contact their deity, then they are free to do so before they enter the meeting.

[sunny-dave]

Not a link, but a reminder of the actual facts here - which seem to have got lost in the usual sh!t-storm of phoney media outrage.

The judge did NOT say that prayers could not be said *before* council meetings.

His ruling said that the local councils do not have the powers needed to "include prayers as an agenda item in the formal part of a meeting".

One crucial difference is that if the prayers are part of the formal agenda, then any councillor absenting themselves from the meeting until prayers were completed would have that absence recorded as a "missed attendance" on their record which could have implications for their future membership of the council.

This is not about 'marginalisation of religion' - it is about the correct separation of secular and religious activity and would apply to any/all religious observances of whatever faith.

[lcg]

ratter - i had stated that i was aware of the other thread in religion. what i am after is opinion, but also any link that could be of interest of how religion and it's followers are facing marginalisation or difficulty in modern societies. maybe some of you guys out there know of some more international or interesting examples or perspectives that could assist mr kicker in some way. he is reading books on the subject (snore!), but any specific examples or links will be useful to add to his discussion of the difficulty facing religion in modern societies around the world, as well as in britain. ta muchly x

[lcg]

thankyou for your input so far. i guess i am looking for people who are more familiar with problems in the middle east, israel, the usa etc. where there is much more passion and influence about religion and it's role in society (maybe?). thanks, guys x

[RATTER15]

look on youtube for "Sam Harris"

[rov1100]

Religion is a form of brain washing and should be banned from any public event. The true religious believers can quite easily do it somewhere else in their own time and locality.

[jno]

he could probably look up actual churchgoing statistics and see if they tie in with what is seen of as marginalisation - I suspect they do; if fewer people are going to church, they can hardly complain if the church has less influence. CofE bishops still sit in the House of Lords as of right, which seems improper discrimination against those of other religions (and none).

[lcg]

thanks, guys....keep 'em coming! x

[modeller]

Prayers have been sem-compulsory in many aspects of our lives for millennia . In addition it is expected amongst certain groups. The Royals are expected to attend as it is their duty . Has any Royal ever admitted to being a non believer ? Many RCs and Muslims are frightened not to attend. MPs and many professional people are expected to set an example, whatever their true beliefs.
So how many true believers are there really ? 3-5% !
The reality is that 90% of the UKs population ( of all faiths ) do not regularly attend a place of worship and 60% say they have no interest in religion.
The BBC pumps out about 40 hrs of prayers and services every week. Plus the media gives us our daily dose of religion. So the tiny minority of theists have far more influence on our society than their numbers actually warrant.

[FredPuli43]

Typical of Britain, modeller, is that the law and practice follow the public. The BBC is required by law, in its constitution, to 'pump out' a given time of Christian religion. It does its best to ignore this, because its public has changed. That's why the 'daily service' is only on long wave. The BBC's head of religious broadcasting is a Muslim, which suggests a certain breadth of approach to the whole subject!
The old Education Act, 1944, required schools to have a Christian assembly and religious education 'broadly Christian in character' That was watered down both in practice and law later. Apart from the general view of the public, it was a little impractical when some schools had 80 per cent or more Muslim intake. Some such were C of E schools. C of E schools in the state system are themselves a historic anomaly, from the fact that so many schools were founded as church schools.

[modeller]

Relgion has always been a weapon of power . It was Emperor Constantine who imposed Christianity on his empire but not for religious reasons , he never became a Christian himself, but he was amazed at the power of the bishops and it is reported he said:
" The blind faith of Christianity has more power than a hundred Roman Legions, and he wanted that power.

In our armed services church parades were compulsory up to 1946 but in the week they were made voluntary only a handful turned up. So the following week the orders were # For those not attending church there will be a rifle inspectiuon. # Not surprisingly attendance shot up again.

[jno]

Constantine did become a Christian

[modeller]

jno According to Roman records he remained true to his Roman Gods but the Pope claimed he had a death bed conversion but he would wouldn't he ?
He also claimed Constantine had fought all his battles under the Christian banner. Take your pick.

Constantine was baptised on his death bed and was followed by his sons who unfortunately were not as inspired as their father before them. They became co-emperors and eventually one of them became sole ruler until the year 361AD.

A subsequent Emperor, Julian the Apostate (Constantine's nephew) tried to reinstate the pagan gods but this was short lived and Christianity entrenched itself increasingly as the state religion. Julian was the last emperor to worship the old pagan gods.