Should schools be allowed.to exclude pupils who do not abide by the rules

[youngmafbog]

Once again this is in the news. Seems the doogooders think pupils should not be.exckuded for breaking rules.such as dress.code. The problem is if you allow one rule to be broken where do you stop.Discipline needs.to be paramount in schools this seems to be undermining the teqchers once again.

[Gromit]

http://www.telegraph....chool-exclusions.html

[rockyracoon]

The trouble is of you let one away with it, then hoards will all do the same thing. Rules at school are a good lesson for working life, I'm sure if you turned up to work on Tesco shop floor in anything other than the uniform and refused to change, you'd be sacked.

[Gromit]

// [ The Children'Commissioner said ] Pupils should no longer be expelled or suspended for “minor infringements” because it can damage their education and push them into a life of crime, said Maggie Atkinson.
In a major report, she said children should only be sent home for safety reasons or to prevent disruption to other pupils. //

Seems sensible to me.

Is a 'do-gooder' just someone with a differing view to yours?

[Gromit]

// The Office of the Children’s Commissioner is a national organisation led by the Children’s Commissioner for England, Dr Maggie Atkinson. The post of Children’s Commissioner for England was established by the Children Act 2004 with the intended purpose of becoming the independent voice of children and young people, thereby championing their interests and bringing their concerns to the national arena.
More than 130 organisations campaigned for the establishment of a Children’s Commissioner for England for 13 years. Professor Al Aynsley-Green was appointed England's first Children's Commissioner in March 2005. //

You may now blame the last Noo (I believe that is how you spell it) Labour Government for this twaddle.

[Old_Geezer]

It is part of the job requirement to be able to judge and decide on different circumstances as they occur. It would be good to issue guidelines to ensure a consistent experience across the country, but a decent head should know when the pupil has gone to far and should be excluded, and when they are merely playing up and should be dealt with by the school.

Dress code indeed. If the demanded code is reasonable then that should only result in an exclusion if there is multiple / consistent infringement, in which case it goes beyond the clothes worn and is a 'lack of authority' and, "can't do anything with them", failure on the part of the school, issue.

[d9f1c7]

The problem is that the handwringers have removed any form of control away from the teachers over the years so all they have is the nuclear option of expulsion. Now they want to remove that. The left won't stop until they have achieved a state of anarchy in the schools and learning is non existant. Then they can turn out the lawless thugs they love so much.

[Kromovaracun]

Am I the only person who is amused by the OP's atrocious syntax? Kind of makes me imagine one of the Gumbys shouting "DITHIPLINE IN THKOOLZ" on a street corner somewhere.

[Kromovaracun]

" The left won't stop until they have achieved a state of anarchy in the schools and learning is non existant"

Could you please demonstrate to me how uniform policies do anything to support learning? Thanks.

[sp1814]

" The left won't stop until they have achieved a state of anarchy in the schools and learning is non existant"

Anyone who ACTUALLY believes that needs to see a psychologist - urgently. That thought process is the result of paranoid psychosis.

Seriously.

[Old_Geezer]

I suspect that is deliberate exaggeration to indicate annoyance at what was considered the end result of a particular political viewpoint. We all do things like that to drive home a point, don't we ?

It seems to me governments of both left and right have control over the years, and since the Labour party lurched right under Tony, mainly right of late. So if any political persuasion is responsible for the present situation ....

[sp1814]

d9f1c7

Do you REALLY believe what you've written.

I mean...do you really, really, really think that 'the left' (and that term needs clarifying) actively want a society of lawless thugs roaming the street.

To what end would they want to see a break down in manufacturing, commerce, financial services etc?

Concomitant to that, we would see a massive rise in unemployment which in turn would rupture our balance of payments figures and send inflation (and benefit payments through the roof).

Are you saying that the destruction of normal life in the UK is the aim of the left?

Do you know how crazy that sounds?

I mean, literally - crazy, crazy, crazy.

I'd love to hear your reasoning - perhaps I'm wrong and can't see something that you can?

[Kristal53]

As a parent I support uniform policy for the simple reason kids need less clothes - having had two children go through teenage years at schools abroad with no uniform policy I have had to deal with bullying and pressure to buy the latest fashions etc. to be in the 'in crowd' at school. That perhaps is a different subject though. Rules are rules and constant disobedience of the rules is insubordination and should be dealt with accordingly - the odd infringement can be dealt with in school without the need for exclusion, on the understanding that if it happens again a sterner line will be taken. I've always thought taking a child out of school was more a treat for the child than a punishment

[sp1814]

Common sense dictates that there should be an escalation of punishment.

First offence - warning.
Second offence - detention
Third offence - suspension

And so on...but it should be down to the individual heads to determine policy. Way, way, way before a school expels/excludes a child, there should have been a dialogue with its parents or guardians.

If after all avenues have been exhausted, and the child still refuses to follow simple rules, then bye bye. School discipline is absolutely paramount. Kids can 'express themselves' like the rest of us do - in their own time.

[Gromit]

Biography of Dr Maggie Atkinson (Children’s Commissioner for England)

Maggie Atkinson has been Children’s Commissioner for England since March 2010. She has a 30 year career working with and in the interests of children and young people.
The Children’s Commissioner began her career teaching English and taught in a range of schools from inner cities to shire counties for 11 years. Before taking up the post she was Director of Children’s Services in Gateshead. This involved leading staff in various professions and disciplines, as well as 88 partner schools. She also headed revenue budgets for all council services for children and young people.
On the national stage Maggie has been President of the Association of Directors of Children’s Services, Chair of the multi-agency Centre for Excellence in Outcomes and Chair of the Children and Young People’s Workforce National Partnership which included skills councils, unions, third sector stakeholders and public bodies. In addition, Maggie Atkinson held a range of positions in local government including County Manager (Education Standards) at Cheshire County Council, Assistant Director (Quality Assurance) at Warrington Council, Ofsted Inspector at Kirklees MBC, and Adviser, Schools Management Support at Birmingham City Council.

-------

She seems like an highly qualified lefty do-gooder hellbent on bring anarchy and destruction to the country. Perhaps that assessment is slightly wrong.

[d9f1c7]

Calm down sp1814, it was a clarksonesque deliberate hyperbole, stated to express anoyance at what the left have done to education over the last generation or so.

[sp1814]

d9f1c7

Ah...I geddit.

Bring back italics, bold type and emoticons to AB I say.

[youngmafbog]

Whilst true the left interferred to the point teachers hsrdly have control and the little darlings ooman rights are paramount I was rather after tge point people felt discipline breaks. Not sure i got an answer with everone taking umbridge rather than debate.

[jno]

always amusing when people talk as if Labour has held unbroken power since the 1980s - they just can't face the fact that Maggie was in power for a decade or so and Cameron is now, and maybe it's really a rightwing problem.

Gromit, I think you may be confusing Maggie Atkinson with her evil twin Darth.