Pensioners what's the point in trying?

[MoonRocker]

work hard all your life to provide an income so not be dependent on the state, what happens? You get hammered, forced to sell house to pay for care etc taxed on what income you do get and generally treated as a second class pensioner, second class that is to the lazy done nothing life long scroungers who now get everything free! Brilliant! So please people tell me what is the point? As far as I can tell it's better to spend what you earn save nothing and arrive at retirement age absolutely potless! If the governement wants to sort things out then I reckon this is a huge anomoly with which to get started.

[Duncer]

Elucidate.

Please explain why should they should have to do this when those who have contributed the square root of f&%k all can get the same treatment for nothing.

[emmie]

zeuhl, exactly right.

[emmie]

same debate over and over, those who pay get diddly squat. those who don't get lots.

[Zeuhl]

fried green

your argument is confused

<<I have saved for my old age my house is my pension' >>

that tends to be stated by younger people looking ahead to old age. In cases where that comes to pass, the house will already be gone - liquidated to fund the pension. You can't have both.

The point is, we either provide care for our old, infirm people or we don't. What we can't do is provide it free for those who have no assets but charge others because they do.

That is unfair and undermines the fundamental (and necessary) practice of saving for the future.

If some people accumulate sufficient assets that they can make private provision and not use state provided facilities then all to the good.

[Hastler]

I am wondering how the government will deal with the situation I am in with my father under the proposed regulations.
My mother left me her half of the house so we are joint owners and I have also lent my fater £35,000 and put a charge on his share of the house.
The house is worth about £330,000 but his share is only now about £130,000.
Will the government try taking back the half of the house left to the offspring by the deceased husband / wife?.

[Graham-W]

I'm afraid I agree with the "sell your house and pay your own way" brigade. If you have been fortunate enough to be able to put money aside to buy your own house you should be able to pay for your own care.
There are plenty of others who haven't been so lucky, have lived in rented accommodation, worked hard all their lives and come to old age with nothing. These need government support.
There are others who have p*ssed it all against the wall, never worked a day in their lives and contributed nothing to the pot.
Perhaps it's time we looked at re-introducing the Workhouse system, brought up to a modern standard of course.

[Hastler]

I can see what you are saying Graham but if I lend Dad say another £50,000 and interest acumulates he will probably have no equity in the house by the time he needs care.

[Old_Geezer]

Further to the above friedgreentomato, many of the older generation not only saved for their old age, and to pay a mortgage, they also paid into the public kitty so that they were eligible for pensions and care. And now when it is time to be the helped rather than the contributors the rules are being changed to deprive them, strangely just as the next generation are due to pick up the responsibility for the country's wealth generation.

[Old_Geezer]

World of difference between those who were not able to contribute and those who chose not to, Graham. Until the two groups can be identified and an agreement made as to fair treatment to all, I don't think depriving the prudent is a reasonable course of action. More of a case of the government knowing they can push one group around and get away with it.

[emmie]

it's like being punished for the same crime twice.

[bentaxle]

Well i'm past eighty and if the wife has to go into a home first into some of the homes I have visited lately I would burn the bloody thing down rather than let the goverment have It took me 25 years to buy it and I believe the mortgage rate was 15% then, so we went without a lot for this place
Why the hell cant they offer us a pill when we get to our age ,Anything would be better than some of these places I've seen
Ask any of the old men in these places when they were young what they would like to happen when they arrive at this stage in life they would soon them

[ummmm]

My grand parents are happy in their homes.

[DaisyNonna]

Do not have a home to sell. Have saved all my life. Husband cleared out joint bank account and cleared off. Gave up his job and cried penury. What am I supposed to do if I need care?

[ummmm]

That's not is dispute, Daisy. It's having to sell up to pay. You will get the same care as someone who is paying privately.

[emmie]

daisy, throw yourself on the mercy of the council?

[ummmm]

Why? Do they treat privately funded patients better?

[woofgang]

Not quite true ummmm. The places that charge ss minimum may be okay but if you have more money to spend you can get better accommodation just like hotels.

[emmie]

if you have no money, that is all you could do..

[ummmm]

My Nans is like a hotel. Lovely place. Grandads is a bit more dated but as he doesn't leave his room it makes no difference. They are self funded.

[bentaxle]

Umm
I'm sure they are and alot of old people settle in them well but some don't
I've just visited my brother in one ,He went through all the last war on frigates sub hunting in the atlantic and russian conveys and its not only cruel its bloody wicked to see him Had you asked him years ago what should be done at this stage I know what the answer would have been










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