ChatterBank0 min ago
Time For Plan B Says Imf
// George Osborne should curb Britain’s austerity plan within months, the International Monetary Fund warned today.
The Chancellor was told the economy still ‘looks bad’ and the Budget in March would be a ‘good time’ to reconsider his Plan A programme of cuts. //
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The Chancellor was told the economy still ‘looks bad’ and the Budget in March would be a ‘good time’ to reconsider his Plan A programme of cuts. //
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Gromit #Would you care to try and justify the £325billion of Quantative Easing the Government has conjurered out of thin air? . Printed fantasy money p*ssed away. #
Make up your mind, Gromit first you suggest the government should pour money into the economy and now you complain about when they did.
If it was wrong then, it is wrong it now.
You have still not told us where the money is coming from in you plans B,C,& D.
At present we pay £48 billion in interest alone thanks to Labour and you want to increase that even more.
Make up your mind, Gromit first you suggest the government should pour money into the economy and now you complain about when they did.
If it was wrong then, it is wrong it now.
You have still not told us where the money is coming from in you plans B,C,& D.
At present we pay £48 billion in interest alone thanks to Labour and you want to increase that even more.
The Labour legacy is there, the mountain of debt and depletion of reserves, nothing we can do about that now, so we may as well stop bleating. The fact is that we are also seeing a two tier Europe opening up which is impacting on us, Northern Europe still strong for exports, the South in recession, strong exports to the USA and Far East, but then it does appear the skids are coming under the Chinese economy (that's actually more worrisome for the Germans then us as out of our export total only 3% goes there, whereas in Germany it's 30%).
That stat actually brings up a hell of a question and that is it appears that many companies and perhaps our Government (past and present) have not pushed enough for the Chinese market.............we can't afford such complacency.
Plan B for me would include pushing on with Plan A - it is imperative we have to work the deficit and debt down. However, I would now chuck Trident in favour of (i) the Forces (ii) the second Aircraft carrier (iii) and the balance to be used in business promotion and development, directly from government and not through the current banks. A tax could also be brought in on the banks that penalises their failure to lend money to businesses, i.e. if they don't hit a certain performance strike rate, then they lose it. Also, it's time for a shake-up of complacency in the retail banking sector by making it easier for competition to develop, and perhaps encourage more the building society type of operation again.
The High Street - well that is more complex than what folk are whittling on about. It's changing - period, not only by the disposable income in folk's pockets but by changing channels (advent of internet being the largest), the change in distribution (where is the Royal Mail in this - plonkers - killing themselves and before gromit and his lot scream - then justify their overseas rates!!!), never mind other retail sources.
NJ's yarn of the lack of service in stores unfortunately is also true and part of the demise - the "I can't give a feck attitude that is killing certain chains.
For example, I went into Boots to buy my brand of deodorant - they didn't have it. "When will you have a new batch in?" "I don't know" - "Could you order me one then?" "I don't know." "Could you find out then?" Grumpily, she comes back, "He doesn't know either." Result, I go on-line and buy it 30% cheaper and delivered by courrier in 3 days, they have lost my business and, in doing so, made me more internet-shopping savvy and prone to make a lot more purchases that way. Idiots.
That stat actually brings up a hell of a question and that is it appears that many companies and perhaps our Government (past and present) have not pushed enough for the Chinese market.............we can't afford such complacency.
Plan B for me would include pushing on with Plan A - it is imperative we have to work the deficit and debt down. However, I would now chuck Trident in favour of (i) the Forces (ii) the second Aircraft carrier (iii) and the balance to be used in business promotion and development, directly from government and not through the current banks. A tax could also be brought in on the banks that penalises their failure to lend money to businesses, i.e. if they don't hit a certain performance strike rate, then they lose it. Also, it's time for a shake-up of complacency in the retail banking sector by making it easier for competition to develop, and perhaps encourage more the building society type of operation again.
The High Street - well that is more complex than what folk are whittling on about. It's changing - period, not only by the disposable income in folk's pockets but by changing channels (advent of internet being the largest), the change in distribution (where is the Royal Mail in this - plonkers - killing themselves and before gromit and his lot scream - then justify their overseas rates!!!), never mind other retail sources.
NJ's yarn of the lack of service in stores unfortunately is also true and part of the demise - the "I can't give a feck attitude that is killing certain chains.
For example, I went into Boots to buy my brand of deodorant - they didn't have it. "When will you have a new batch in?" "I don't know" - "Could you order me one then?" "I don't know." "Could you find out then?" Grumpily, she comes back, "He doesn't know either." Result, I go on-line and buy it 30% cheaper and delivered by courrier in 3 days, they have lost my business and, in doing so, made me more internet-shopping savvy and prone to make a lot more purchases that way. Idiots.
Modeller,
I notice you didn't answer the question.
I have answered where money froplan B comes from, the same place as the £325Billion.
If the £325Billion had filtered down to the public then the economy would have been stimulated. People would be spending again. Businesses would be growing. Instead, the £325Billion went straight to the banks. The theory was that they would then lend it to businesses, only they didn't and just picketed the money.
I notice you didn't answer the question.
I have answered where money froplan B comes from, the same place as the £325Billion.
If the £325Billion had filtered down to the public then the economy would have been stimulated. People would be spending again. Businesses would be growing. Instead, the £325Billion went straight to the banks. The theory was that they would then lend it to businesses, only they didn't and just picketed the money.
It's not realistic, gromit. Quantitative Easing is, in the final analysis, pseudo-debt, and not to be condoned. It does not really help the macro-economy, and potentially can lead to rampant inflation. That is not a route we can take over the medium horizon time. We are better off without it and tax the banks who do not bleed what has gone in already.
I would also consider moving to a sales tax system than VAT (both at national and Council level), it's simpler and fairer and yes, it's akin to the States system - but then we would need to be better displaced (not removed) from the Eurpoean Union.
I would also consider moving to a sales tax system than VAT (both at national and Council level), it's simpler and fairer and yes, it's akin to the States system - but then we would need to be better displaced (not removed) from the Eurpoean Union.
Not all the world is suffering from recession. Why not just ignore the EU for a while and try to increase trade with countries outside the EU. They have obviously tried this tack but is their persistance enough. For instance with China why not operate a i'll scratch your back and you can return the favour so that trade is equalised between the two. It could mean more government intervention but don't they control our lives anyway?
I agree - and that I think is where our brain drain is showing, the lack of expertise in export sales, something I am finding down here in the SW, when I talk to a number of different companies ré work prospects, in sectors like aeronautics, marine and oil services, as well as green technology......
That could be an easy win for the Government - identify the expertise pool with the CBI, and develop programmes for developing talent and monitoring, as well as cultural and negotiation tactics advice and marketing/communications into certain key overseas markets, some form of assignment to companies with the government picking up the costs (my costs for example) as a means of investment - an "Olympics of Industry Drive" as was done post Barcelona after our dismal performance there.
A few years ago Tony Blair's government was criticised for offering bribes to Saudi Arabia in order to get orders even though it benefited our country immensely. We shot ourselves in the foot by referring those deals to the Serious fraud office, plonkers that we were just to appear whiter than white. At the same time other countries were doing the same thing to get orders and was all hushed up.
Gromit # I have answered where money froplan B comes from, the same place as the £325Billion.#
But you said it didn't work and yet you want to do it again.
You say # the £325Billion went straight to the banks #
So you dont want the money to go to the banks.
OK , so apart from bankrupting us even further by printing another £325 billion how are you going to distribute it without the banks to check to credit worthiness of everyone who wants a hand out.
Maybe you could hand it to your union friends in true soviet style.
But you said it didn't work and yet you want to do it again.
You say # the £325Billion went straight to the banks #
So you dont want the money to go to the banks.
OK , so apart from bankrupting us even further by printing another £325 billion how are you going to distribute it without the banks to check to credit worthiness of everyone who wants a hand out.
Maybe you could hand it to your union friends in true soviet style.
gromit #he £325Billion of Quantative Easing was criminally misused. Most of it went straight back to the banks #
You asked #Would you care to try and justify the £325billion of Quantative Easing the Government has conjurered out of thin air? . Printed fantasy money p*ssed away. #
I disagreed with it then and I disagree that we should do it again now . However you said it went to the banks who haven't loaned it out so it's still there. In that case we don't need to do it again anyway . It would only stoke up inflation and our debt.
The reason the world is in the mess it is , is because of unlimited lending and printing money principally in the property markets.
You want to do it again.
You asked #Would you care to try and justify the £325billion of Quantative Easing the Government has conjurered out of thin air? . Printed fantasy money p*ssed away. #
I disagreed with it then and I disagree that we should do it again now . However you said it went to the banks who haven't loaned it out so it's still there. In that case we don't need to do it again anyway . It would only stoke up inflation and our debt.
The reason the world is in the mess it is , is because of unlimited lending and printing money principally in the property markets.
You want to do it again.
Well I seem to have put the cat among the pigeons with my tales of wealth and affluence!
No, I don’t dine at the Ivy, Fred, so alas I’ve never bumped into you (mind you, The Crown on Seven Dials just opposite does a nice jumbo sausage in a roll!). I’m talking about places at the lower end of the market and in particular places that cater for “hard pressed families with kids”. These are not places I go to (I avoid anywhere that caters especially for children) but are places that I have noticed when passing. Places like Nando’s, Garfunkels, Pizza Hut and so on as well as the two meals for a Tenner outlets. Every time I pass them they are packed. If people generally are “struggling to put food on the table” these places and others which involve discretionary spending would be deserted, and they’re not. Places I do frequent are likewise. Strangely yesterday I phoned to book a table at my local curry house for tomorrow night. It’s nothing grand, but clean, friendly with good food. “Can you come a little later [than 8pm] sir, as we’re a bit busy?”
Fortunately DTCRossword has confirmed my observations of surly indifferent service. The assistants I encountered in PC World were not busy, the store was very quiet (unsurprisingly since they seem to have no goods to sell) and I had to prise one of them away from a group who were discussing the previous night’s football. The function of shops is to sell the goods their customers want. If they don’t have them and the staff are unwilling or unable to get them they do no business. Simples. Then they bleat about the fate of the High Street.
Of course some people (and businesses) are struggling. I appreciate that. But there are always people who struggle, even in the best of times. There always will be, as there will always be millionaires in the worst of times. But I’m talking in general terms. I can only call it as I see it and everywhere I go businesses that are providing good value goods and services efficiently supplying the things that people want seem to be doing quite nicely. (Just on the issue of cruise availability, there will always be deals on cruises. The market has been about 20%-30% overprovided for many years, long before the “credit crunch“).
Oh, and just as an aside, I have never claimed to be a judge any more than Gromit has claimed to be a plasticine dog.
No, I don’t dine at the Ivy, Fred, so alas I’ve never bumped into you (mind you, The Crown on Seven Dials just opposite does a nice jumbo sausage in a roll!). I’m talking about places at the lower end of the market and in particular places that cater for “hard pressed families with kids”. These are not places I go to (I avoid anywhere that caters especially for children) but are places that I have noticed when passing. Places like Nando’s, Garfunkels, Pizza Hut and so on as well as the two meals for a Tenner outlets. Every time I pass them they are packed. If people generally are “struggling to put food on the table” these places and others which involve discretionary spending would be deserted, and they’re not. Places I do frequent are likewise. Strangely yesterday I phoned to book a table at my local curry house for tomorrow night. It’s nothing grand, but clean, friendly with good food. “Can you come a little later [than 8pm] sir, as we’re a bit busy?”
Fortunately DTCRossword has confirmed my observations of surly indifferent service. The assistants I encountered in PC World were not busy, the store was very quiet (unsurprisingly since they seem to have no goods to sell) and I had to prise one of them away from a group who were discussing the previous night’s football. The function of shops is to sell the goods their customers want. If they don’t have them and the staff are unwilling or unable to get them they do no business. Simples. Then they bleat about the fate of the High Street.
Of course some people (and businesses) are struggling. I appreciate that. But there are always people who struggle, even in the best of times. There always will be, as there will always be millionaires in the worst of times. But I’m talking in general terms. I can only call it as I see it and everywhere I go businesses that are providing good value goods and services efficiently supplying the things that people want seem to be doing quite nicely. (Just on the issue of cruise availability, there will always be deals on cruises. The market has been about 20%-30% overprovided for many years, long before the “credit crunch“).
Oh, and just as an aside, I have never claimed to be a judge any more than Gromit has claimed to be a plasticine dog.
You may be witnessing the other side to the 'you can always sell Bentleys'. NJ. You can always sell cheap second hand cars too; it's been noticeable, since the recession set in, that the trade can't get clean s/h cars for the prices it used to get them for. What happens is that the cheapest end, be it supermarkets or car dealers, does well, and so does the dearest. So Lidl and Fortnum's do well. It's the middle market that suffers most.
The McDonald's of this world will survive, though it's noticeable that McD's have been advertising cheap menus of late. And they attract those who might eat out elsewhere, but won't because they tighten their purse strings. Another factor is the reward factor; people will treat themselves occasionally , if they can, to relieve the pressure they feel. This factor may be see in toy shops too; however bad things are, people will spend on their children, and the toy trade is only 1 per cent down on previous years
The McDonald's of this world will survive, though it's noticeable that McD's have been advertising cheap menus of late. And they attract those who might eat out elsewhere, but won't because they tighten their purse strings. Another factor is the reward factor; people will treat themselves occasionally , if they can, to relieve the pressure they feel. This factor may be see in toy shops too; however bad things are, people will spend on their children, and the toy trade is only 1 per cent down on previous years
Don't be nieve Gromit....you think the government knew nothing about it. Cameron was in Saudi Arabia recently to drum up exports to them as has all previous governments. Read this:
///It is alleged by insider legal sources that the money was paid to Prince Bandar with the knowledge and authorisation of Ministry of Defence officials under the Blair government and its predecessors. For more than 20 years, ministers have claimed they knew nothing of secret commissions, which were outlawed by Britain in 2002.///
Only an allegation but you wouldn't expect them to admit to it would you.
///It is alleged by insider legal sources that the money was paid to Prince Bandar with the knowledge and authorisation of Ministry of Defence officials under the Blair government and its predecessors. For more than 20 years, ministers have claimed they knew nothing of secret commissions, which were outlawed by Britain in 2002.///
Only an allegation but you wouldn't expect them to admit to it would you.
Gromit # Tony Blair's Government did not bribe anyone. #
For once I agree with you :
Blair didn't have to bribe anyone, that is done through agents. The agent
negotiates all the prices which includes bribes/commisions. Blair like all other countries leaders remain squeaky clean .
It doesn't matter what the law is regarding bribery and corruption by working through a third party neither the buyer nor the seller are directly involved. If one country refuses to work that way they don't get the contract, it's as simple as that. By devious Blair prosecuting BAE it has put thousands of our jobs at risk for which France among others are grateful.
Quizmonster #as well as downright criminality - of our casino bankers...ie major Tory backers. #
Even if you are right, it all happened during Labour's watch ! So why didn't they do something about it ? They had the power and the time .
If you look at the IMF report for 2007 we entered the crisis in a worse position than any other major economic power,.What did Labour do ?
They went to your despised Casino Bankers and went on a spending spree. They then printed another £325 billion, to try to balance your Casino Bankers books , that's your comrade Gromit's figures so it must be true. Who, according to your comrade Gromit , they tucked it away and didn't loan it out. He by the way, as you know, wants to do it again.
By the way , would you tell me who these Casino Bankers are ? Their accounts would make interesting reading .
Even if you are right, it all happened during Labour's watch ! So why didn't they do something about it ? They had the power and the time .
If you look at the IMF report for 2007 we entered the crisis in a worse position than any other major economic power,.What did Labour do ?
They went to your despised Casino Bankers and went on a spending spree. They then printed another £325 billion, to try to balance your Casino Bankers books , that's your comrade Gromit's figures so it must be true. Who, according to your comrade Gromit , they tucked it away and didn't loan it out. He by the way, as you know, wants to do it again.
By the way , would you tell me who these Casino Bankers are ? Their accounts would make interesting reading .
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