A Sentance So Richly Deserved.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324254/Tia-Sharps-killer-Stuart-Hazell-jailed-38-years-parole.html

At last a sentence to fit the crime, he will be 75 years old before he is released.

Yesterday Tia's father said that, whatever jail sentence this monster received, he should be hanged at the end of it.

Does anyone agree?

[andy-hughes]

ChillDoubt - of course it's not justice. It is the instant primeval reaction of a father imagining his children defiled and murdered in this way when I, by definition their protector and guardian from birth to my death, was unable to save them.

But instant primeval reactions are not civilised, and they are not justice either, which is why we let the laws and the courts provide us with balanced considered punishments in which emotion and revenge play no part - and that is the entire crux of my argument.

Wanting revenge is a natural human reaction - but that does not mean it is the right thing to do.

Procreation is an equally powerful and primeval force - but rape is not tolerated either.

Our urges make us human - our laws to protect all of us, sometimes from each other - are what make us civilised.

[ChillDoubt]

Thanks Sqad, praise indeed!

Andy, you continue to mention revenge, not an emotion I've expressed.
For some reason you're confusing my yearning for a sentence to fit the crime as some sort of personal retribution against Hazell, who has done nothing to harm me. I'm more detached, hence 'revenge' doesn't really come into it.

[Zeuhl]

/my yearning for a sentence to fit the crime/

chill we've already got one

locked up for at least 38 years in a sh1thole prison surrounded by other lowlifes

please explain why your notion of a 'fit' is any more 'proper' than that

[Sqad]

Zeuhl.........LOL

[ChillDoubt]

Yeah, 3 meals a day, baccy, telly, reading material, pool, table tennis, gym, sounds like a right sh1thole.

Still, plenty to keep him occupied and enough time to 'reflect'.

[jim360]

I think most people fail to appreciate the difference loss of freedom can make. I noted earlier, perhaps elsewhere, that the "comfortable prison" sounds a lot like my life at the moment, without the freedom to go outside. It's seriously boring. I know if I didn't have an escape from that cycle I'd go mad with boredom. No, it's not fun at all. Not necessarily hell on Earth, by any stretch of the imagination. But not pleasant, either. Dull, repetitive and continuous, with no freedom.

[Zeuhl]

/Yeah, 3 meals a day, baccy, telly, reading material, pool, table tennis, gym, sounds like a right sh1thole./

We may be going round in circles here Chill

but I think you have still to identify which 'disadvantaged' and hard-pressed people you meet in your 'real world' would want to swap with Stuart Hazell and enjoy all his 'comforts' for the next 38 years

[Zeuhl]

^
perhaps you could ask your 'Focus Group' in the NHS staff rest room

:-)

[ChillDoubt]

but I think you have still to identify which 'disadvantaged' and hard-pressed people you meet in your 'real world' would want to swap with Stuart Hazell and enjoy all his 'comforts' for the next 38 years
---------------------------------
Who said anything about swap? The vast majority of colleagues said he deserved death, either by hanging or lethal injection.

I'm sure the hard-pressed and disadvantaged victims would like to swap though.

[ChillDoubt]

perhaps you could ask your 'Focus Group' in the NHS staff rest room
-----------------------------------
Apologies that the heinous murder and defiling of a 12 year old girl amuses you, but then the life and welfare of the perpetrator so often takes precedent as a 'cause celebre' than that of the victim and their family.

[Khandro]

FredPuli; Because a person wishes to die does not necessarily prove that they are mad, many sane people do so, but as long as it is deemed to be an act of insanity by the home office people like Brady are in a Catch 22 situation; "because he wants to die he must be insane, therefore we shall not let him do so". If he was in a Japanese prison for example I think he would be allowed to get on with. The wiser oriental view (and also in parts of Europe) is that a person's life is their own, if you wish to terminate it, that is your business and no one else's.
andy-hughes; Allowing someone to commit suicide is not murder.

[jim360]

Allowing a criminal to commit suicide isn't justice either.

Where's all this individualism come from? What about our place in society as a whole? My life may be "my own" to some extent, but it touches many and will, I hope touch even more at some point that I have yet to meet. It seems very self-centred to view it as no-one else's business.

[Zeuhl]

/the life and welfare of the perpetrator so often takes precedent as a 'cause celebre' than that of the victim and their family. /

Well Chill

I reckon you've posted about his 'life and welfare' as much as me so don't go all sanctimonious on us

/the hard-pressed and disadvantaged victims would like to swap though./

so you reckon that prison is just one step better than violent death?
I would agree with you

Certainly doesn't sound like the 'holiday camp' you were implying earlier

[Zeuhl]

/Apologies that the heinous murder and defiling of a 12 year old girl amuses you/

That's a despicable, low and stupid thing to suggest Chill

If you had any sense you'd recognise that I was amused not by the murder, but by your attempt to present your colleague''s opinions as some kind of statistically significant factor in the debate

[ChillDoubt]

That's a despicable, low and stupid thing to suggest Chill
---------------------------------
Just a retort to your fecetious comment with added smiley Zeuhl.


but by your attempt to present your colleague''s opinions as some kind of statistically significant factor in the debate
-------------------------------
Aren't they? Maybe you're falling into the same mindset as Kenneth Clarke did a fortnight ago by misjudging the views of the general public.

And of course, it's no holiday camp:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/392269/Time-to-get-tough-on-holiday-camp-prisons

[Zeuhl]

/Aren't they?/

No
Obviously not

If you work in the NHS I hope you have a better understanding of statistical validity than that

'Does this treatment work?'

'Yeah, we tried it out on a few of the guys in the staff rest room. They don't have what you have but they said it was OK'

[Zeuhl]

/ And of course, it's no holiday camp: /

And your evidence is an article in.....

The Daily Express (LOL)

Really Chill?

Bless...

[ChillDoubt]

Maybe these will suffice then?:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2224620/War-holiday-camp-jail-perks-Prisons-Minister-Jeremy-Wright-calls-privileges-earned-hard-work-good-behaviour.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22341867

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-21959284

Continually scoffing at what's staring you in the face by way of facts doesn't really enhance your stance, does it?

[askyourgran]

It amazes me to listen to these lily-livered liberals who want to see lowlife like Hazell kept alive, those men who have tortured young babies and young girls lounging in prison...boring existence well tough they won't be contemplating
the life they have taken for every day of their lives. I found todays reasoning adequate: http://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/399637/What-is-the-point-of-keeping-this-child-killer-alive

[jim360]

It amazes us, equally, to hear people so eager for another man's death. Would you do it yourself? Would you watch? Would you enjoy seeing him suffer?

It's just a different class of crime.