News1 min ago
The Radicalisation Of British Muslims
This letter, from Dr Taj Hargay, Director of the Muslim Educational Centre of Oxford, was published in last night’s London Evening Standard.
//BRITISH Muslims are being exposed to a poisonous theology from three major sources. The mullahs preach a primitive dichotomy between Muslims and unbelievers that extends to virtually every area of life. That message gets fed down to worshippers in mosques across the UK, then to impressionable minds in the madrasahs, the Muslim supplementary schools. This warped Wahhabi/Deobandi Islam is nothing but a blatant religio-cultural distortion derived not from the Koran but from manufactured religious sources like the alleged hadith sayings (compiled some 300 years after Mohammed's death), the sharia - a concoction of medieval clerical opinion - and the fatwahs - dubious religious rulings. With no balancing alternative that you must be an effective stakeholder and become fully integrated into society, this conditioning furnishes the perfect gateway theology for misguided Muslims to become alienated and radicalised. The Government is making a big mistake in focusing on diversionary measures such as the "Snoopers' Charter" rather than attacking toxic theology and religious indoctrination. Why does it continue to pour taxpayers' money into organisations that endorse the dissemination of divisive propaganda?
Academic specialists on Islam have the intellectual capacity to challenge the clergy's binary division of the world - but many are fearful of being branded as heretics by the orthodox establishment. Sadly, much of British Islam is merely a giant echo chamber of Saudi ideology. For Islam in the UK to move forward, it needs a complete root and branch reform so that it becomes naturalised to this country while remaining faithful to authentic Koranic principles of cosmopolitan pluralism and peaceful co-existence.//
This is what is happening in Britain today. We ignore it at our peril.
//BRITISH Muslims are being exposed to a poisonous theology from three major sources. The mullahs preach a primitive dichotomy between Muslims and unbelievers that extends to virtually every area of life. That message gets fed down to worshippers in mosques across the UK, then to impressionable minds in the madrasahs, the Muslim supplementary schools. This warped Wahhabi/Deobandi Islam is nothing but a blatant religio-cultural distortion derived not from the Koran but from manufactured religious sources like the alleged hadith sayings (compiled some 300 years after Mohammed's death), the sharia - a concoction of medieval clerical opinion - and the fatwahs - dubious religious rulings. With no balancing alternative that you must be an effective stakeholder and become fully integrated into society, this conditioning furnishes the perfect gateway theology for misguided Muslims to become alienated and radicalised. The Government is making a big mistake in focusing on diversionary measures such as the "Snoopers' Charter" rather than attacking toxic theology and religious indoctrination. Why does it continue to pour taxpayers' money into organisations that endorse the dissemination of divisive propaganda?
Academic specialists on Islam have the intellectual capacity to challenge the clergy's binary division of the world - but many are fearful of being branded as heretics by the orthodox establishment. Sadly, much of British Islam is merely a giant echo chamber of Saudi ideology. For Islam in the UK to move forward, it needs a complete root and branch reform so that it becomes naturalised to this country while remaining faithful to authentic Koranic principles of cosmopolitan pluralism and peaceful co-existence.//
This is what is happening in Britain today. We ignore it at our peril.
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Iggy, I already attack toxic theology and religious indoctrination. What the author of the letter has in mind, I have no idea. Why don't you write to him and ask him? You’ll find the address here.
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It's an interesting letter but I find your comment
//This is what is happening in Britain today.// just as interestinfg
I'm pretty certain you're not a regular at your local mosque and I'm not sure how many muslims you spend time with so I wonder why you comment that.
Surely you're not just saying that because it agrees with your prejudices?
I have no doubt this happens - when you trace back radicals they will have this background but the letter makes this sound as if it is the norm and I'm not sure I'm willing to take one mans word on this.
Taj Hargay is a well known promoter of a extremely liberal form of Islam - a bit of a Church of England Islam. Now that would be the sort of Islam a lot of us would like to become dominant but it's probably way to the left of the vast majority of muslims - expressions like 'the alleged hadith' are not going to win him a lot of friends!
Now if you look at this letter from that perspective what he's sayiing is 'Hey UK government, stop wasting money on surveullance and start enforcing my view of Islam on British Muslims'
I think that's short sighted - If the UK government starts attacking specific Islamic philosophy it'll entrence attitudes
Nothing like having the Government tell you what you should believe to harden viewpoints eh?
I've a better idea for Mr Hargay - Let's let him stick with fighting theological battles and let the Government worry about people advocating and planning violence
//This is what is happening in Britain today.// just as interestinfg
I'm pretty certain you're not a regular at your local mosque and I'm not sure how many muslims you spend time with so I wonder why you comment that.
Surely you're not just saying that because it agrees with your prejudices?
I have no doubt this happens - when you trace back radicals they will have this background but the letter makes this sound as if it is the norm and I'm not sure I'm willing to take one mans word on this.
Taj Hargay is a well known promoter of a extremely liberal form of Islam - a bit of a Church of England Islam. Now that would be the sort of Islam a lot of us would like to become dominant but it's probably way to the left of the vast majority of muslims - expressions like 'the alleged hadith' are not going to win him a lot of friends!
Now if you look at this letter from that perspective what he's sayiing is 'Hey UK government, stop wasting money on surveullance and start enforcing my view of Islam on British Muslims'
I think that's short sighted - If the UK government starts attacking specific Islamic philosophy it'll entrence attitudes
Nothing like having the Government tell you what you should believe to harden viewpoints eh?
I've a better idea for Mr Hargay - Let's let him stick with fighting theological battles and let the Government worry about people advocating and planning violence
Jake, //Surely you're not just saying that because it agrees with your prejudices?//
For ‘prejudices’ read disagreeing with Jake.
//Now that would be the sort of Islam a lot of us would like to become dominant but it's probably way to the left of the vast majority of muslims - expressions like 'the alleged hadith' are not going to win him a lot of friends!//
Precisely the point he is making.
For ‘prejudices’ read disagreeing with Jake.
//Now that would be the sort of Islam a lot of us would like to become dominant but it's probably way to the left of the vast majority of muslims - expressions like 'the alleged hadith' are not going to win him a lot of friends!//
Precisely the point he is making.
/// Now that would be the sort of Islam a lot of us would like to become dominant but it's probably way to the left of the vast majority of muslims ///
There we have it straight from the Left's mouth piece, "the majority of Muslims are right-wing", if this is so, then why are you forever supporting them Jake?
There we have it straight from the Left's mouth piece, "the majority of Muslims are right-wing", if this is so, then why are you forever supporting them Jake?
No for prejudices read pre-existing judgement
I partially agree with this but I don't automatically believe things I read at face value even when they support my opinions - or at least I try not to.
I ask myself who has written them and whether they have an agenda that might not be apparant.
This man is promoting a form of Islam that is more liberal than found pretty much anywhere in the world - and he's rather disturbingly using current tensions to plead for the government support in establishing it.
It's not as blatent and distatefully exploitative as the EDL's hijacking the Lee Rigsby killing but it comes from the same opportunist place.
If Islam in the UK it to undergo a 'root and branch reform' as he wants that has to come from British Muslims and not from the British government any more than the Government should turn around to the Catholic Church and say 'Right in the shadow of paedophile priests we're going to pass legislation to allow priests to marry'
I partially agree with this but I don't automatically believe things I read at face value even when they support my opinions - or at least I try not to.
I ask myself who has written them and whether they have an agenda that might not be apparant.
This man is promoting a form of Islam that is more liberal than found pretty much anywhere in the world - and he's rather disturbingly using current tensions to plead for the government support in establishing it.
It's not as blatent and distatefully exploitative as the EDL's hijacking the Lee Rigsby killing but it comes from the same opportunist place.
If Islam in the UK it to undergo a 'root and branch reform' as he wants that has to come from British Muslims and not from the British government any more than the Government should turn around to the Catholic Church and say 'Right in the shadow of paedophile priests we're going to pass legislation to allow priests to marry'
he also thinks
"there is a linkage, I believe, between what Tony Blair did with his illegal war in Iraq and subsequent slavish following of US policy. I mean, there was no Muslim terrorism in the United Kingdom until Blair went illegally into Iraq. And I think we need to admit and to acknowledge that fact… not just to blame it on Islamic fundamentalism."
"there is a linkage, I believe, between what Tony Blair did with his illegal war in Iraq and subsequent slavish following of US policy. I mean, there was no Muslim terrorism in the United Kingdom until Blair went illegally into Iraq. And I think we need to admit and to acknowledge that fact… not just to blame it on Islamic fundamentalism."
Jake, // No for prejudices read pre-existing judgement//
Please don’t insult my intelligence.
//he's rather disturbingly using current tensions to plead for the government support in establishing it.//
Why disturbingly? This is a subject that has been at the centre of social tensions for a very long time. The author has said quite openly that “Academic specialists on Islam have the intellectual capacity to challenge the clergy's binary division of the world - but many are fearful of being branded as heretics by the orthodox establishment.” - and that is the problem. Until more Muslims have the courage to stand against radical Islam, as he is doing, nothing will change – and yes, the government should support them.
I sometimes get the impression that some of the people here would rather things didn't change.
Please don’t insult my intelligence.
//he's rather disturbingly using current tensions to plead for the government support in establishing it.//
Why disturbingly? This is a subject that has been at the centre of social tensions for a very long time. The author has said quite openly that “Academic specialists on Islam have the intellectual capacity to challenge the clergy's binary division of the world - but many are fearful of being branded as heretics by the orthodox establishment.” - and that is the problem. Until more Muslims have the courage to stand against radical Islam, as he is doing, nothing will change – and yes, the government should support them.
I sometimes get the impression that some of the people here would rather things didn't change.
