3Rd World Shanty Town In Suburban London.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337695/Shanty-town-suburban-London-street-Romanians-scrape-living-amid-squalor-dump.html

I ask all those who wish to hand out a welcome to anyone who seeks a new life in Britain, is this the kind of squalor you wish these people to live in, because next year when the doors are fully opened this type of thing will only get worse.

So what is your answer?

[emmie]

i don't have one, but i would say those who think our streets are paved with gold are sadly much mistaken.

[emmie]

there have been many who rent out spaces in their gardens, in sheds and lockups, sounds funny, it isn't, those who people who do this are preying on the vulnerable, who may not know where to get help if they don't speak the language.

[woofgang]

'twas ever thus

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmgZyUUQIDk

[emmie]

was it, it's got worse here i do know that. I see more people than ever on the streets, from my own experiences i know that many are mentally ill, or have drink, drug problems. More coming from overseas who don't have jobs, and any money to support themselves should be actively discouraged, it's tough enough now, and not going to get any better in the near future.

[jno]

Isaak Winogradsky fled Cossack terror to live in Bethnal Green 100 years ago, seeking work as a trouser presser. Still, his sons Baruch and Lovat both became Lords - Bernard Delfont and Lew Grade. Who's to say the children of these more recent migrants will not bring us all equal delight?

[anotheoldgit]

jno

Yes and some could become, potato pickers if there is any land left by that time, to cultivate.

[emmie]

and who is to say they weren't the exception to the rule. Not all made it big, i see more people piling into the capital, and poverty is returning big time.

[naomi24]

//Isaak Winogradsky fled Cossack terror to live in Bethnal Green 100 years ago, seeking work as a trouser presser. //

I really don't think the Jews who have come here over the centuries can be compared to the general influx of Eastern Europeans we're seeing today. I’ve never seen a Jew harassing people for money, and I’ve never seen a Jew entering other people’s property to rifle their dustbins – but I’ve seen plenty of Eastern Europeans doing both. The Jews have a completely different mindset; they have always made their own way in life, they have never been a burden on the state, and I actually think that such a comparison is an absolute insult to their work ethic, their determination, and to their integrity.

[jno]

[i] I’ve never seen a Jew harassing people for money, and I’ve never seen a Jew entering other people’s property to rifle their dustbins – but I’ve seen plenty of Eastern Europeans doing both[i]

I'm unclear how you can detect the religion of beggars; but you might have seen both 100 years ago or more. Fagan was written as a Jew. The stereotype of the Jewish ringleader of petty crime has been handed on to Romanians, among others.

[emmie]

Dickens would have known all about that seedy side of life, he was after all a court reporter. His experiences made his stories come to life, and the characters were undoubtedly based on people he would have come across in his early life. Having said that the people who now inhabit the east end of London are not Jews or cheeky cockneys, but Bangladeshis, Pakistanis, Somalians and newly arrived East Europeans, who seem to be rather at the bottom end of the pecking order, not for nothing is that part of the world known for it's poverty. Parts of Brick Lane is all curry houses, but the top end, it's a very long lane, is very eclectic, and very chi chi these days, which i believe is a good thing, otherwise it will get like some areas have in the capital, a mono culture where no European is seen, what a sad day that would be - in the city that is supposed to welcome diversity.

[naomi24]

jno, nice try, but it doesn’t work. We’re talking about hordes of people – not one fictional Jew whose character was arguably based upon Dickens’ own prejudices. There is no stereotyping. This is happening now!

[FredPuli43]

Quite. Why aren't they claiming housing and benefits like all the other foreigners are supposed to be doing ? And why they are they working at all? It's absolutely scandalous.

[emmie]

by my reckoning, the Jewish people who came here did so fleeing from persecution mostly, they integrated and got on with their lives, some like the Orthodox Jews didn't and still don't seem to mix much. A number of distant relatives live in a sleepy backwater, and have had to face the prospect of East Europeans descending on their little oasis, some work on farms, but they have caused more problems by their drunken loutish behaviour, not my words by the way, but those of the local police. It isn't midsomer, but not far off, so the locals haven't appreciated this one little bit.

[jno]

this talk of Jewish "work ethic, their determination, and their integrity" is unfortunately racist poppycock; Jews can be nice or nasty, the same as anyone else.

http://www.bunker8.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/orgcrim/3804.htm

Note that Dickens' prejudices don't come into it.

[emmie]

criminals come in all shapes and sizes, colours and ethnicity, by the large they are a small minority.

[emmie]

assume you know who these are.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder,_Inc.

[ichkeria]

"this talk of Jewish "work ethic, their determination, and their integrity" is unfortunately racist poppycock; Jews can be nice or nasty, the same as anyone else. "

Well said.

[jno]

I didn't, em! A gap in my education - thanks.

[naomi24]

jno, Oh how funny! You change your tune and give me the Krays! Priceless! May I remind you that you held the achievements of a Jewish family up as a shining example of successful immigration - and you brought Dickens into the discussion – not I. Of course there are bad eggs in all societies, but Jewish immigrants, on the whole, have always made their own way in life, they have never been a burden on the state, and they do have a superb work ethic – so in effect, in my praise of Jewish society, I was agreeing with your correct assessment of the Winogradsky family! Seems now you’re disagreeing with yourself! Never mind. The cry of the same old faithful retainer that some people here seem to depend upon to stifle the truth – racism – has gone up, so perhaps the discussion will now change course. ;o)