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I'm All For Equality But...
106 Answers
this is a step too far IMHO:
http://
Females can carry out just about every job there is in HM Forces but infantry soldier/Special Forces is not and should not be one of them.
Maybe a handful would be up to the physical and mental challenge but there are extremes of situation and circumstance that females are just not suited for.
Opinions?
http://
Females can carry out just about every job there is in HM Forces but infantry soldier/Special Forces is not and should not be one of them.
Maybe a handful would be up to the physical and mental challenge but there are extremes of situation and circumstance that females are just not suited for.
Opinions?
Answers
I don't think women are suited mentally or physically to combat. We are designed for having children and body shape and design are to bear and nurture babies. Without going in to too much detail there are plenty of reasons a woman would not be suited. Men and women are not interchangea
22:32 Thu 08th May 2014
There seems to be an assumption that automatically, by virtue of being a man, I would be suited to these roles. Which is just utter baloney.
It may be, and probably is, that men are in general more suited to these roles than women, but there are clearly going to be exceptions, on both sides, and it's surely right to recognise that and to open up the roles for all women -- indeed, for all people -- that want to serve their country in this way.
It may be, and probably is, that men are in general more suited to these roles than women, but there are clearly going to be exceptions, on both sides, and it's surely right to recognise that and to open up the roles for all women -- indeed, for all people -- that want to serve their country in this way.
-- answer removed --
kavalidir
/// Times change and I think this is far more about male ego being threatened than any justifiable objection. ///
It has nothing to do with male ego and is demeaning to men to suggest it is.
Women are always going on about their inbuilt differences, mother instinct etc etc.
Well is it not feasible that men also have some long inbuilt differences, one being their inbuilt senses that tell them that their females need protecting, women and children first and all that.
What would these women's libbers think if they were on a sinking ship and the men pushed them out of the way to get to the lifeboats?
/// Times change and I think this is far more about male ego being threatened than any justifiable objection. ///
It has nothing to do with male ego and is demeaning to men to suggest it is.
Women are always going on about their inbuilt differences, mother instinct etc etc.
Well is it not feasible that men also have some long inbuilt differences, one being their inbuilt senses that tell them that their females need protecting, women and children first and all that.
What would these women's libbers think if they were on a sinking ship and the men pushed them out of the way to get to the lifeboats?
andy-hughes
You don't have to be a soldier to kill, look at those rebels in Syria and the Ukraine.
Your dream is so unrealistic, say someone fancies invading this country, would we send diplomatics to the beaches to have a good chat to the invaders hoping that they will change their mind and go home?
Or would we go around the streets asking for volunteers to pick up whatever weapons to hand, travel to the beaches and have a go at beating the invaders back.
Or would it be best to have an organised, disciplined and well trained body of men & women ready to be deployed at a minutes notice?
I think the latter option is the only way.
But carry on dreaming Andy, just thought if we could get everyone to lead an honest life, we could then get rid of the police, and the jails along with their staff.
You don't have to be a soldier to kill, look at those rebels in Syria and the Ukraine.
Your dream is so unrealistic, say someone fancies invading this country, would we send diplomatics to the beaches to have a good chat to the invaders hoping that they will change their mind and go home?
Or would we go around the streets asking for volunteers to pick up whatever weapons to hand, travel to the beaches and have a go at beating the invaders back.
Or would it be best to have an organised, disciplined and well trained body of men & women ready to be deployed at a minutes notice?
I think the latter option is the only way.
But carry on dreaming Andy, just thought if we could get everyone to lead an honest life, we could then get rid of the police, and the jails along with their staff.
I personally don't think women should be excluded from any career because of their sex.
There was a time when no-one (even the woman herself) thought that a woman could ever become Prime Minister...and then in 1979...
This reminds me of one of my favourite exchanges in the sitcom 'Friends':
Ross: What kind of a guy makes delicate French cookies? Huh? They're not even butch manly cookies with... y'know, with chunks.
Joey: That's like a woman wantin' to be a...
Ross: A what? A what? What's the end of that sentece?
Monica: Yes, what is the end of that sentence?
Joey: Ummm... a penis model.
There was a time when no-one (even the woman herself) thought that a woman could ever become Prime Minister...and then in 1979...
This reminds me of one of my favourite exchanges in the sitcom 'Friends':
Ross: What kind of a guy makes delicate French cookies? Huh? They're not even butch manly cookies with... y'know, with chunks.
Joey: That's like a woman wantin' to be a...
Ross: A what? A what? What's the end of that sentece?
Monica: Yes, what is the end of that sentence?
Joey: Ummm... a penis model.
Jeza
/// Why on earth would women want to be equal to men. We all know that we are far superior. For a start show me a man that can multi task. I could go
on. ///
Being able to multi-task is not a sign of being superior, it just that men take on the more complicated and complexed tasks and leave the more simple less complicated one's to the women, so that they are more able to take on more of these. :0)
/// Why on earth would women want to be equal to men. We all know that we are far superior. For a start show me a man that can multi task. I could go
on. ///
Being able to multi-task is not a sign of being superior, it just that men take on the more complicated and complexed tasks and leave the more simple less complicated one's to the women, so that they are more able to take on more of these. :0)
People sometimes talk about 'being rescued by a fireman'...
Now, I understand that the Fire Service has altered it's entry rules to opebn the job market up to women, however, I don't think we should automatically think of women as incapable of performing tasks that men can.
Put bluntlly - if I were in a burning flat and the ladder came up, I would be far happier with Fatima Whitebread assisting me, than Charles Hawtrey.
Now, I understand that the Fire Service has altered it's entry rules to opebn the job market up to women, however, I don't think we should automatically think of women as incapable of performing tasks that men can.
Put bluntlly - if I were in a burning flat and the ladder came up, I would be far happier with Fatima Whitebread assisting me, than Charles Hawtrey.
-- answer removed --
AOG - "You don't have to be a soldier to kill, look at those rebels in Syria and the Ukraine."
Of course not, and that is the fundamental reason why meachanised western armies fall foul of rag-tag local militia - 'our' soldiers are trained to do a job, and that is what it is, a job. They don't especially care who their enemy is, it's just someone else to shoot at when ordered to do so.
The local population however have a vested interest in protecting their political and social freedoms, and the cultural history to make dying for those freedoms a matter of course.
However, I know my dream is a seriously remote possibility, but every single advance made by humankind has been made because someone somewhere asked "What if ..." so there is nothing wrong with my aspiration - it beats sending men and women to die for pointless political causes any day.
Of course not, and that is the fundamental reason why meachanised western armies fall foul of rag-tag local militia - 'our' soldiers are trained to do a job, and that is what it is, a job. They don't especially care who their enemy is, it's just someone else to shoot at when ordered to do so.
The local population however have a vested interest in protecting their political and social freedoms, and the cultural history to make dying for those freedoms a matter of course.
However, I know my dream is a seriously remote possibility, but every single advance made by humankind has been made because someone somewhere asked "What if ..." so there is nothing wrong with my aspiration - it beats sending men and women to die for pointless political causes any day.
AOG - "Being able to multi-task is not a sign of being superior, it just that men take on the more complicated and complexed tasks and leave the more simple less complicated one's to the women, so that they are more able to take on more of these. :0)"
I take your tongue-in-cheek point that multi-tasking is not 'superior', merely a different skill, but i would dispute your reasoning for the origins of the differences.
In prehistoric times, Man would hunt, so his entire focus was on finding and killing something to bring home. Woman would stay home and look after the children, and that is where the differences started to assert themselves -
Man developed a single-minded approach to tasks, including excellent long sight for spotting prey in the distance, but that meant that his near-sight was poorer.
Woman developed the much-applauded 'multi-tasking' which included tending the fire, making sure the children didn't either fall into said fire, or wander off and get eaten. That makes her close vision far superior.
Come up to modern day, and that is why whewn a husband can't find his car keys, his wife sees them sitting on the table in front of him.
A small example of the differences, which have dovetailed together throughout human evolution and got us to where we are now.
The important differences, and the fact that they co-exist, has aided evolution and development, and we should celebrate rather than deride this fundamental co-operatiopn between the sexes.
Oh, and to return to the thread - no, women should not be fighting on the front line - but only because men should not be there either!
I take your tongue-in-cheek point that multi-tasking is not 'superior', merely a different skill, but i would dispute your reasoning for the origins of the differences.
In prehistoric times, Man would hunt, so his entire focus was on finding and killing something to bring home. Woman would stay home and look after the children, and that is where the differences started to assert themselves -
Man developed a single-minded approach to tasks, including excellent long sight for spotting prey in the distance, but that meant that his near-sight was poorer.
Woman developed the much-applauded 'multi-tasking' which included tending the fire, making sure the children didn't either fall into said fire, or wander off and get eaten. That makes her close vision far superior.
Come up to modern day, and that is why whewn a husband can't find his car keys, his wife sees them sitting on the table in front of him.
A small example of the differences, which have dovetailed together throughout human evolution and got us to where we are now.
The important differences, and the fact that they co-exist, has aided evolution and development, and we should celebrate rather than deride this fundamental co-operatiopn between the sexes.
Oh, and to return to the thread - no, women should not be fighting on the front line - but only because men should not be there either!
Obviously the thread has moved on a bit whilst I've been in work.
Yes, for those asking for confirmation I was in HM Forces, first as an infantry soldier for some 5 years, then 3 years as a Royal Military Policeman. Throughout that time I have no hesitation in saying that the best Sgt Major I had in command over me was a female and drew respect from all ranks. I mentioned the sleeping quarters at Crossmaglen, South Armagh because I stayed in them.
For those whe mention pilots etc yes, no problem with that, they are taught Escape & Evasion and how to deal with being shot down, interrogation etc.
My argument is one of teeth arms though, those at the Forward Edge of the Battle Area. Do we want and can we expect females to engage in hand to hand fighting to the death? It has happened within the living memory of most of us:
http://
That scenario aside, the pitfalls already mentioned (capture by Taliban, torture, rape etc all filmed for broadcast) do not bear thinking about.
There have been lots of good links provided by posters on here whereby even senior ranking females have denounced the idea.
Furthermore, when it comes down to it we are NOT created equal. A fact of life is that(generally) women will never run, cycle or jump as long or as fast as men. Fact.
It is not in their genetic make-up to out perform men physically and their presence on the front line/FEBA will become the focus of too much attention, a distraction and ultimately a liability.
Yes, for those asking for confirmation I was in HM Forces, first as an infantry soldier for some 5 years, then 3 years as a Royal Military Policeman. Throughout that time I have no hesitation in saying that the best Sgt Major I had in command over me was a female and drew respect from all ranks. I mentioned the sleeping quarters at Crossmaglen, South Armagh because I stayed in them.
For those whe mention pilots etc yes, no problem with that, they are taught Escape & Evasion and how to deal with being shot down, interrogation etc.
My argument is one of teeth arms though, those at the Forward Edge of the Battle Area. Do we want and can we expect females to engage in hand to hand fighting to the death? It has happened within the living memory of most of us:
http://
That scenario aside, the pitfalls already mentioned (capture by Taliban, torture, rape etc all filmed for broadcast) do not bear thinking about.
There have been lots of good links provided by posters on here whereby even senior ranking females have denounced the idea.
Furthermore, when it comes down to it we are NOT created equal. A fact of life is that(generally) women will never run, cycle or jump as long or as fast as men. Fact.
It is not in their genetic make-up to out perform men physically and their presence on the front line/FEBA will become the focus of too much attention, a distraction and ultimately a liability.
did you understand the points i was making that rape has occurred within the ranks of the British military, so the idea that a female soldier will be at risk from same by the enemy is a moot point, i understand the hand to hand combat analogy, but is that really how the likes of the Taliban, Al Quaeda operate, they seem to be hit and run - IEDs killing most of our service personnel
No emmie, I wouldn't agree.
As I said, it's all about the dynamic and the extremes.
It simply would not work. As someone else pointed out, some soldiers may feel they have to specifically protect a female amongst them, others would feel resentment, some may show affection, start a relationship or even be caught in a compromising situation whilst out on ops and it quickly spirals out of control.
Females on the front line would be the biggest can of worms imaginable and would lead to many males leaving in droves, thus diminshing the effectiveness and capability of (IMHO) the best Armed Forces in the world.
As I said, it's all about the dynamic and the extremes.
It simply would not work. As someone else pointed out, some soldiers may feel they have to specifically protect a female amongst them, others would feel resentment, some may show affection, start a relationship or even be caught in a compromising situation whilst out on ops and it quickly spirals out of control.
Females on the front line would be the biggest can of worms imaginable and would lead to many males leaving in droves, thus diminshing the effectiveness and capability of (IMHO) the best Armed Forces in the world.
that is some kind of joke surely. ^
i am pretty sure the two women police officers killed in the line of duty not that long ago were doing their job, lured to an address then killed in cold blood, how many have been injured during large scale demonstrations, how many injured when the riots took place., far too many, the idea that women police officers would stand idly by then claim the arrest is total nonsense, and does a great injustice to all women police officers.
i am pretty sure the two women police officers killed in the line of duty not that long ago were doing their job, lured to an address then killed in cold blood, how many have been injured during large scale demonstrations, how many injured when the riots took place., far too many, the idea that women police officers would stand idly by then claim the arrest is total nonsense, and does a great injustice to all women police officers.
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