Niqab Ban - Right Or Wrong?

[agchristie]

Another place of learning faces accusations of 'Islamophobia'. Despite the guidelines, should there be a complete ban in schools, universities, courts, etc where visualising interaction is necessary or would this be seen as discriminatory to Muslims?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/camden-school-for-girls-in-discrimination-storm-after-demanding-16yearold-removes-niqab-9751735.html

[janbee]

right !

[RATTER15]

I think that we should launch a big campaign promoting the niqab as the sexiest thing a woman can wear and publicise a few porno films with women wearing them. That may alter their thinking a little. The more clothing they wear, the sexier they look. Before you know it, you will have Muslim women walking the streets in bikinis. Lol

[Baldric]

Svejk, A Turban doesn't hide the wearers identity, so why ban them?

[Svejk]

that's why I ask the question. Are we saying all pupils have to conform to dress codes and there's no room for 'religious' exceptions or could muslims feel they're being singled out.
Not that I believe, for a second, that wearing burqas, niqabs etc. has any religious meaning. (its political, imo)

[Old_Geezer]

I don't find the question as easy as some here because it falls under two 'rights' in my opinion. The right to wear or not wear what you want and not be dictated to, and the right of others to be able to see who it is they are with. For me it is deciding the priority, since the two clash.

I've contributed to threads on this question before and have reluctantly concluded then, and still think now, that the right of others to not have someone hiding amongst them is more important.

In the case of school children I can see that could be considered harsh, so I'm not 100% against making kids an exception, (although 6th form is getting on a bit for concessions) but since they eventually have to live as an adult in an adult society it is probably best to learn that hiding like that isn't on.

And I would hold the concern that to do so when young might even encourage isolation / lack of integration with the others, maybe resulting in stunted social skills and possibly even issues of self worth, given that hiding is not the 'norm' here. So it is probably not a good idea then either.

In any case, was the school rules not known in advance ? Surely this should not have been a shock to anyone ? What is all this about wearing veils ok, but not a niqab in the 6th form ? Is that a new rule ?

[Old_Geezer]

Just to add I don't feel niqab in general public, out of schools, is really on either, for exactly the same reasons. One right being given priority over another. Not that it is a big issue for me, but being asked the question ...

[lindapalmara]

Why can't we have a secular society like France? How many terrorist have evaded justice by wearing the veil. How can you identify someone shrouded in black. How do you know the right person is sitting an exam?

[naomi24]

//As a matter of interest, would you then have to ban the turban. Personally, I don't feel 'uncomfortable' with men/boys in turbans. //

Unless a ban was imposed upon all religious symbols, no. The point here is that the face is covered, rendering the wearer unidentifiable.

[RATTER15]

Personally I would like to see the turban removed so that motorcyclists can obey the same laws as we do and wear a crash helmet when on a motorcycle.

[ummmm]

I've never seen a motorcyclist wearing a turban.

[anotheoldgit]

Yes that ridiculous dress should be banned along with the wearing of turbans on motor cycles and the carrying of ceremonial swords in public places.

Perhaps they would ban the Niqab, if there was a mass protest and everyone wore it, or perhaps the EDL should start off by wearing the garb on their protests against the rise of Islam?

[sandyRoe]

You're not suggesting that the EDL should become cross dressers, are you, AOG?

[Old_Geezer]

I think they'd be very cross. But there again they always seem to be.

[brionon]

You must understand that Muslim men are driven mad with desire at the sight of a woman's face and hair !!

[tamborine]

If pupils dont abide by school rules, suspend & expel. No more than defaulters will get in employment market.

[ToraToraTora]

what about a TCT? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1213811/You-plonkers-Sikh-policeman-suing-Force-asking-wear-modified-turban-says-I-felt-like-I-Only-Fools-Horses.html

[Old_Geezer]

IMO a crash turban is a good idea. Either the law applies to all and we all need a crash hat if riding a motor bike, or it should apply to none. We don't see non-turban wearers complaining an 'Only Fools and Horses' feel when wearing their non-turbanned crash hat.

Being aware of others sensibilities is a fine aim, being over anxious so some groups are treated as a special privileged case, while the rest of us toe the line, is not a good idea. Balance is always needed.

[chaptazbru2]

I'm sure I read fairly recently that Littlewoods is going to start selling the hijab due to public demand ? Many people said they would no longer shop there after this revelation ...

[jourdain2]

Right.

[jourdain2]

Re. turbans and motorbikes. Sikhs have never been problematic in any way except this. If I remember rightly, it was their demand to be excused motorbike helmets (because of the turban) which started the whole thing of religious dress exemptions and consequent problems. I can only speak from my experience in Bradford, but girls wearing thick tights (the leg-covering bit) with regulation school uniform used to be the norm in the early 1970's. We made a big mistake in allowing our laws to be modified to suit other cultures and religions.