Another Poll On The Eu

[sunny-dave]

Data from a Comres poll for the Independent on Sunday last weekend - summarised in a nice graphic :

http://oi59.tinypic.com/9fz0g4.jpg

Full data here :

http://www.comres.co.uk/poll/1293/sunday-mirror-independent-on-sunday-poll.htm

Confused or what?

[New Judge]

No it's not confusing, Dave.

52% of British people think that they should have the right to live and work elsewhere in the EU whilst only 36% believe people from other EU nations should have the right to live and work in the UK.

It's a conundrum associated with te UK's EU membership. Many people like the advantages but do not like the downside. They cannot have it both ways.

[sunny-dave]

That's exactly what I meant NJ - people seem to want the advantages, but not the perceived drawbacks ...

[whistonian]

And the other 12% judge ?

[jim360]

It's hard to see any renegotiations having only an impact on immigration into this country, rather than out. And indeed in general it's difficult to see the rest of the EU accepting changes that benefit our national interest whilst simultaneously hurting the interests of the EU. Cameron's attempt to negotiate a better position is not likely to achieve anything more than putting off a discussion that we should probably be having around about now, or at least not that long after the next election, and should be framed as a vote on continued EU membership rather than on what piecemeal changes he does manage to get out of the negotiations.

In the meantime rising support for UKIP might make it even harder to leave the EU, ironically -- although that might not be true if the votes are coming even more from Labour/ LibDems than from disgruntled Tories.

One way or another, we should try to settle the issue as to whether or not we want to stay in the EU soon.

[jim360]

Separate polls, whistonian (or at least separate questions) so there's no reason for it to add up to 100%. There will anyway be some overlap of people who are happy to see traffic go both ways (or, at least, who appreciate that it has to).

[ToraToraTora]

yes but how many are in both groups? The 36% could also be encompassed in the 48% that don't think they should have the right to live and work anywhere in the EU. Those figures show nothing useful at all.

[ToraToraTora]

might as well say 52% like bananas and 36% hate apples!

[DTCwordfan]

Are we selfish or still harbour dreams of imperialism.....can't have it both ways!

The thing that I would be doing is introducing legislation that limits benefits to at least 2 years wait within the EEC and 4 or even 5 years for non-EEC. I can not see Cameron negotiating in limitations on the right to work or travel and neither should he - that's a key membership right of Europe, though an Ozzie-style points system or US Green Card may work for non-EEC and be introduced quickly - and perhaps that ought to be done on a common platform for all member states, still allowing the state the right to take immigrants to their job market needs.

Back to Europe, does anyone have data when member states allow benefits to immigrant groups both from within and without the country? I haven't the time to research it.

[mikey4444]

Sunny-dave. This isn't in anyway surprising...its just hypocrisy, plain and simple. Some people want to have their cake and eat it too !

[sunny-dave]

About 16% of them I think, Mikey :)

[anotheoldgit]

Yes but it is not quite a level playing field is it, the reason for the two different outcomes is because those workers from the EU who come to Britain (a much smaller area) are a drain on our infrastructure, whereas British workers who work in Europe (a much larger area) are not a drain on their infrastructure.

[Gromit]

The British Public also want membership, but do not want to pay subs. Asked if we should stay in Europe and the majority say yes. Ask anything about our membership payments and they will say it should be less or zero, even if they don't know what the figure is.

[Gromit]

AOG
// Yes but it is not quite a level playing field is it, the reason for the two different outcomes is because those workers from the EU who come to Britain (a much smaller area) are a drain on our infrastructure, whereas British workers who work in Europe (a much larger area) are not a drain on their infrastructure. //

Europe isn't divided into just two countries, the 'UK and 'Not the UK'.

There are plenty of countries with a smaller land area than the UK in Europe.

And people who come to the UK to work are paying taxes, they are not a drain. It is true that in some places that the infrastructure has not caught up, but that is due to bad planning.

[anotheoldgit]

Gromit

Take your point about smaller EU countries but the countries most UK workers head for are France and Germany.

And unlike the UK, do these countries also provide our workers with accommodation?

[jno]

wasn't this the whole basis of the British Empire? We go and take over their countries. They don't come here and take over ours (in fact they don't come here at all, except to bear tribute to the Empress).

[Gromit]

// And unlike the UK, do these countries also provide our workers with accommodation? //

I would assume they do. Just like migrants here, they would have to pay rent out of their earnings. They would not get free accommodation provided by the state, but neither do migrant workers coming to our shores.

[mikey4444]

I have a close relative who went to work in Germany 20-odd years ago, as a Brickie, much in the way of "Auf Wiedersehen Pet" and was very glad of the work. But he now lays bricks here in Wales and is constantly complaining of the "foreigners" working along side of him, from Europe. I have called him a hypocrite to his face but all he says is "thats not the point "

Not sure what the point is if it isn't hypocrisy ?

[Svejk]

We earned more than the Germans. Didn't go there working for 15% of their wage.

[Old_Geezer]

"people seem to want the advantages, but not the ... drawbacks"

Ain't that always the truth ?

[mikey4444]

It is indeed OG, but they are still hypocrites !