Greek Crisis

[Ric.ror]

Does anyone have a link to a programme that can explain the Greek crisis to me?

TIA

[mikey4444]

Ric.ror...this a bit long winded but it might help :::::

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_government-debt_crisis

[wolf63]

I tried asking a friend for an abbreviated version of the problem in Greece, he just sighed and said that half their govt officials are in prison and that was just one of the factors.

Still confusing

[stuey]

Ric.ror, since you are interested in the Greek situation, I hope you get some helpful answers. I must say that I haven't a clue as to what it's all about, and I'm not at all interested. I see headlines all the time on the BBC site regarding this: our newspapers barely mention it. I guess that the closer to the "action" you are, the more interested and involved you might be.

[Tilly2]

Interestingly, today's Guardian Travel section has six whole pages promoting travel to Greece.

[ubasses]

In simplistic terms it has allowed people to retire too early on very high pensions and it very much a cash society and has failed to collect 89% of it's taxes. This compares to less 2.5% in Germany.
Neither does it have any industry to speak of, most of it's income depends on tourism.

[EDDIE51]

In the Greek pension system you only need 15 years contributions to qualify for a state pension. It also has a huge 'cash in hand , black economy' .
So a person in Greece leaves school at 17 and gets a job with a pension scheme.
They have paid the 15 years pension contributions by the age of 33, so they then 'drop out' of the system and work in the 'black economy' for cash in hand. At the age of 55 they can then claim their pension and as it is low there is a special 'top up' to bring it up to living wage standard.
49% of all Greek families depend on a pension as the main or only source of income .
Less than 30% of the tax due is ever actually paid in Greece . The 'Black Economy' takes care of the rest.
That is why the offer to increase tax is viewed with 'concern' by the other EU finance ministers!
I wish I was born in Greece!!
Actually it is even worse as the 'Islands' get extra funding and pension to cover the extra cost of 'offshore' services. So a lot of people claim to be living on one of the Greek Islands when they are on the mainland.There are no checks made!

[New Judge]

And of course, not mentioned thusfar, this crisis would not have developed had Greece not been allowed to join the euro under false pretences and subsequently been encouraged to borrow vast quantities of a currency that their economy had no way of supporting.

[Ric.ror]

Probably hence why the Greek government are hoping to sue Goldman sachs

[Old_Geezer]

Probably repeating myself but, age of retirement is not going to affect anything unless your society already has full employment and more job positions to fill. Or if it has failed to provide a welfare state to aid the unemployed. Size of pension compared to other welfare payments might be relevant. The issue is the basic economy. It's not doing well enough to generate sufficient wealth for the public kitty to pay the society's bills. And continual borrowing opportunity has failed to turn the economy around and just got them deeper and deeper into debt. Now it has hit crisis with past lenders not willing to loan more and wanting repayment, but the Greeks have spent it all and have nothing to repay with. Logically they need to get out and sort themselves out but that will be hard on the people for some time.

[malagabob]

On initial entry to the EU Greece was given the same or almost the same credit rating as Germany????

[EDDIE51]

Yes it was a 'stitch up' a fraudulent claim that was not investigated. The EU was so desperate to get them in they did not question the figures.
Now it is part of the problem, if they have to leave it will show that they were only in by fraud in the first place. Those EU ministers that fought to let them in will be made to look incompetent or worse.

[whiskeryron]

it strikes me that Greece is very similar to a couple starting out in life having all their furniture on tick & then continually adding more to their household possessions without ever actually paying anything back.

[fiction-factory]

Probably repeating myself, O-G, but whilst there is something in what you say, I think it's wrong to regard each person as a unit of labour and therefore conclude that it's okay to let people retire at 55 if there are people who are unemployed. Successful economies are ones where people develop and use skills, the best people are in the right jobs, productivity is high, entrepreneurship is encouraged and people set up businesses and thus create more jobs

[EDDIE51]

This link has a lot of relevant information
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-33479946

[EDDIE51]

It's getting worse!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33497353
Greek banks have not even started making plans as to what to do if Greece has to leave the Euro, which now looks almost inevitable and could be as soon as tomorrow Monday.

[whiskeryron]

If there are EU countries so desperate to maintain the Euro fallacy they will do anything to stop Greece from leaving, then let them give all Greeks a double nationality by granting them free & gratis a German Or French passport, thereby making them true EU nationals & including them in another nation's economic status.

[tonyav]

EU summit over Greece has been cancelled !.
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/eu-summit-over-greece-cancelled/ar-AAcSpj8

[ubasses]

Only the summit including non Eurozone leaders has been cancelled, to give the Eurozone leaders & finance minister more chance of reaching an agreement with Greece.

[Khandro]

In case you missed this which I posted on another thread;