Is It About Time With All That's Happening In The World To Allow Citizens Of The Uk To Be Armed?

[Olivio]

What do you think? It's a double edged sword as we'd have citizens readily available to disperse justice to would be criminals and terrorist but then we'd also be arming criminals and terrorists alongside our citizens.

What do you really think?

[andy-hughes]

This is the argument that underpins the gun laws of America - it doesn't work there, and it will not work here.

The presumption that every citizen who would carry a gun is sane, calm, focused, measured, dispassionate, law-abiding, and willing only to use their gun as a last resort is just that ... an assumption.

And a fatally (literally in this case!) flawed assumption at that.

I always quote, and will again - the line from Dirty Harry, which was back in the early 70's, on the subject of people taking the law into their own hands - "Next thing, you execute your neighbour because his dog wees on your lawn ..." and that is the essential point.

The premise that everyone who has a gun is fit to have a gun is simply not valid - and never will be.

[Olivio]

A very powerful and valid point for against Andy-hughes. Let's see if we have an equally responsive retort for Yes.

[trt]

A silly question IMO.

[ummmm]

Absolutely not.

[Tilly2]

That way madness lies.

[jackthehat]

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/zih7pc8vnqyuqn7m3gq9.jpg

[ummmm]

Lol, Jack,

[andy-hughes]

trt - //A silly question IMO. //

Can't agree - it's an entirely legitimate point for a debate.

[mikey4444]

A silly question, from me as well !

[Old_Geezer]

No, obviously not. Do not understand why the question has been posed.

[mikey4444]

As I have said on another thread....we seem to having a lot of weirdo threads today !

[ichkeria]

You want to arm terrorists and criminals?
Seems a bad idea to me

[mikey4444]

Bonkers is a better word ichkeria !

[EDDIE51]

I can't see a single positive argument for this. The 'gun culture' is the reason there are so many shooting deaths in the USA. Stories like the 4 year old who found his mothers gun in an unlocked cupboard and shot her dead would be seen over here. An absolutely terrible idea, thank God it has no hope of becoming law.

[Gromit]

Yep,
Throw a load of guns and knives into the mix. What could possibly go wrong?

[mikey4444]

Eddie....don't worry.

This "idea" has no chance whatsoever of becoming law.

[Clanad]

I would think that the American woman murdered in London by the knife wielding Somali as well as her wounded friends would have thought during the attack about how helpless she was… perhaps wishing she had a weapon to defend herself.

I find it ludicrous that a quote from a movie is used to defend one's views on a serious subject.

Fact is there is a presumption and it's been proven largely true that every citizen that is issued a conceal carry permit, after and FBI background check, is "sane, calm, focused… etc… willing to use their gun as a last resort…" Nearly all mass shootings here in the U.S., tragic as they are, are perpetrated by gun users who came by the weapon in illegal ways. None of the existing laws (and they are plentiful) restricting gun ownership would have prohibited the events that followed.

Same reasoning applies to equally tragic accidents such as the referenced death of a child. It wasn't the "ownership" of the gun (which was entirely legal) but rather the carelessness of the owner that resulted in the death. Same reasoning applies to the use of automobiles (not by 4 year olds but by young people nevertheless) used carelessly by those involved and lack of oversight by the adults in the situation.

I'd agree that the proliferation of guns, especially sidearms, in Britain doesn't equal, in percentages, that of the U.S., but as I've stated numerous times (ad nauseum) I will not cede the safety of my family to the State. Even the best police departments can't help in a life threatening situation when they are only at the other end of an emergency telephone call…

It appears from recent news reports out of Britain that you are all faced with an escalating threat from knife related killings and injuries… what next? outlaw ownership of knives with blades of more than (take your pick) of a certain length? Before I'm accused of cherry picking news reports I think it's incontestable that crimes such as these are increasing (many, apparently by Somali's, but that's another thread). At what point does it become unacceptable?

[mikey4444]

Clanad...there are not many over here that would want America's enormous and growing level of gun violence, and our laws are not going to change any time soon to accommodate it.

[Clanad]

Actually, mikey, the level of gun violence is decreasing… seen here:

http://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/cnsnewscom-staff/more-guns-less-gun-violence-between-1993-and-2013

Here: http://dailycaller.com/2015/12/03/thanks-to-cops-gun-violence-lowest-since-1960s/

And here (etc,): http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/12/04/washington-post-gun-violence-declining-except-gun-free-zones/

No one I know here in the U.S. is advocating copying our gun laws by other countries, certainly not me… but the statistics speak for themselves. I do think it's possible, that as the violent crime in other countries, such as the U.K. increases that attitudes about self-defense may change… dare-say mature?

[EDDIE51]

I could possibly envisage a time when the carrying of a non lethal weapon such as a Tazer or CS gas is permitted in the UK , but never a gun!.