Footballers Shame

[vortex]

The first civil rape case in Scotland is decided.Your thoughts?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-38651041

[vortex]

Could a criminal case now take place in the light of this ruling does anybody know?

[jno]

it could do, but the standard of proof is higher. In civil cases it's on the balance of probabilities, in criminal cases it's beyond reasonable doubt. (Well, that's English law, maybe the Scots do it differently.)

If I were her I'd leave it at that. If they were tried in a criminal court and found not guilty, people might start pointing the finger at her.

[vortex]

Thanks jno - I understand about the burdens of proof and just wondered if the Scottish authorities would review the case?

[ToraToraTora]

I don't think so, this is in effect a suing and claim for damages. The authorities clearly did not think it is possible to gain a conviction and I don't think this changes that. Not sure how it's even possible. Is this a Scottish law facility? I mean can we all sue someone for an alleged crime of any kind against us? I can understand a private prosecution but this isn't that either.

[jno]

sure, nothing stops you suing someone for damages, and you don't don't need a criminal prosecution to back it up.

Given the employee's evidence that she was in such a bad way she needed an ambulance, I'm not sure why they ruled out a prosecution. But I don't think she's got anything more to gain personally by calling for one now.

[New Judge]

Yes 3Ts there's been a few cases where criminal prosecutions have either not succeeded or not been launched but where a civil case (for compensation) has. The crucial difference, as has been mentioned, is the burden of proof. The judge in a civil case only has to believe it is "more likely than not" (i.e. 50.1%) that one version of events is the truth. In criminal cases it has to be "beyond reasonable doubt".

[whiskeryron]

Goodwillie. Not really an appropriate name for a rapist is it ?

[andy-hughes]

This does have chilling parallels with the Ched Evans case.

I am delighted that this woman has managed to bring her case and win it.

She sends out a message to young men who have far too much money and not enough maturity, that young women are not there for their carnal enjoyment whether they are conscious or not - and that has to be a good message to send to everyone.

[andy-hughes]

wiskeyron - //Goodwillie. Not really an appropriate name for a rapist is it ? //

No it's not, but the young man in question did not have the option of his name, but you did have the option of making or not a pointless and inappropriate remark about it - and sadly you decided to take it.

[RandyMarsh]

IS the message only for rich young men Andy?

[vortex]

Randymarsh,I am sure Andy Hughes is referring to any male who seeks to take advantage.In this case,both footballers would have been earning a good salary at Dundee Utd.

[andy-hughes]

RandyMarsh - //IS the message only for rich young men Andy? //

It is for a specific section of rich young men who live feted lives, and do not hear the word 'No' anything like often enough to educate them into the way of life where they don't think that their pleasure is there for the taking with no consequences to them, because they happen to have a talent that is a valuable commodity.

I am sure I don't need to spell it out do I?

[RandyMarsh]

Do you mean footballers?

[andy-hughes]

divebuddy - //Randy Marsh. There you are then, you've been told. So long as you are poor and get the girl tanked up on white lightning, it's ok. Apparently. //

I don't mind you entirely missing the point of many of my posts, which you do on a daily basis - but please do not jump to such unpleasant conclusions and try and attribute them to my views, when they are clearly yours, and yours alone.

Your co-operation is appreciated.

[Sqad]

Seems to me that there is a message there for young women as well.
Don't get drunk.

[vortex]

Sqad - whether the woman was drunk or not it does not give the right for males to assume that any female gives consent to sexual intercourse.

[whiskeryron]

// Avatar Image
andy-hughes
wiskeyron - //Goodwillie. Not really an appropriate name for a rapist is it ? //

No it's not, but the young man in question did not have the option of his name, but you did have the option of making or not a pointless and inappropriate remark about it - and sadly you decided to take it.

I stand well & truly told off.

[andy-hughes]

Sqad - //Seems to me that there is a message there for young women as well.
Don't get drunk. //

It's a little more complex than that I think.

Can we aim for - Getting drunk is not good for you because it rots your liver and can lead to long-term health damage.

Rather than - Getting drunk is likely to make you prey to predatory young men who think you are an easy target for serious sexual assault, so instead of making that responsibility theirs for being unable to behave like mature civilised adults not rutting pigs, let's make it your responsibility for being provocative in the first place.

I think you can see where I'm coming from.

[Sqad]

vortex...your reply above.
We are not dealing with a sober victim, we are dealing with a drunken one, apart from that i agree with your comment.

A-H...I agree with you entirely......but it ain't going to come to pass.