Collective Resposibility

[Khandro]

As some will know, I've been advocating this on here for a long time, finally the penny seems to have dropped. It makes sense, wouldn't you agree?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/terrorists-families-friends-should-be-jailed-failing-alert-authorities-police-max-hill-isis-legal-a7924941.html

[mikey4444]

Difficult thing to put into the law though Khandro.

Would it also apply to the families of drug-dealers, car thieves, benefit cheats, etc, etc ?

[Togo]

It should do Mikey.

[mikey4444]

Togo....then I think that the Courts in Britain would be filled to overflowing, for many years into the future.

Good business for lawyers though !

[Cloverjo]

No. How could it be proven that someone knew the plans of a family member? How could it be proven that the person knew there was a gun or a potential bomb around?

[mikey4444]

It couldn't Jo, which is why this daft idea will never come to fruition.

[jno]

definitely, we need to learn from East Germany, with everyone informing on everyone else.

[THECORBYLOON]

From the article
'Mr Hill, who has prosecuted in cases trialling members of the IRA, al-Qaedaand Isis, highlighted section 38B of the Terrorism Act 2000.

It makes it a criminal offence for anyone who believes someone might be planning an act of terrorism to “not disclose the information as soon as reasonably practicable”.'

'He cautioned that powers to prosecute terrorists’ loved ones should be used “judiciously”, because “it because can be very difficult to prove [what they knew] and the danger is you look like a vindictive state”.'

The legislation is already available but it's difficult to prove.

[Old_Geezer]

"the Government’s most senior adviser on terror laws has said."
So just one person's questionable opinion then. Good luck finding proof the others in a family knew of the terrorist's plans. I think there are already laws about harbouring lawbreakers, so if the evidence was sufficient there ought not be any need for changes.

[Khandro]

The main idea is that it is a deterrent, not simply a punishment. Knowing your mother, father and friends might go to jail for your sins, wouldn't half focus the mind.

[Khandro]

^^ and encourage them to report you.

[gulliver1]

Something like the thought police maybe.

[Old_Geezer]

You really believe those willing to die in order to kill and maim others are gong to be that concerned about a gaol sentence for the family left behind ? I have my doubts; surely they are under the delusion that they are doing something more important than than to be stopped by threats to the family.

[Old_Geezer]

If they don't tell on a family member now, they won't after any change. Unless you are advocating long or life sentences or hanging for not informing.

[Cloverjo]

Really, khandro? If someone's planning an atrocity would they stop and think 'oh, mum might know what I've been planning. Better not do it.'

[Peter Pedant]

// It couldn't Jo, which is why this daft idea will never come to fruition.//

oh some will try
and the usual suspects on AB will clap and cry out
' no c,utting off one hand is not enough!"

collective responsibility was pioneered by ( Hi Khi!) the Germans in the last century so perhaps we should ask Khi how it was done
( camps concentration camps and gas chambers hem hem I really knew the answer)

and by the French in the ALgerian War
Pontecorvo;s film the Battle of Algiers 1966

( special adviser Gen Massu who also appears - and claims he won the battle of Algiers)

the film ends with blowing up the house ( see also chap 1 of The Silver Sword) in which Lulu le Mecque is hiding
hur hur hur good collective responsility there then

The one blown up ( lulu le mecque ) really Sidi abu cleft-beard survives and becomes the algerian minister for something in the film
but hell it IS a film
(tashi Mashi abu saoud or someone)

[Garaman]

I can see how even a terrorist might not want his mum to be punished for his deeds. I read only recently that one sign of a son being close to a suicide attack is that he will get very close to his mother, and be unusually good to her.

[Peter Pedant]

The sis who emailed her brozzer
"dont worry I have deleted all your embarassing emails about bombs n fings"
hadnt ( you need to erase them)
and did time forit under current law

it is rare for British law to impose a duty to act
"inform the authorities about terrorist activity"
beng made to
so insofar (! eek!) as the law is concerned it is already covered

[Cloverjo]

Ok, I just used a mum as an example. It could also have been dad, brother, friend.

[Togo]

//definitely, we need to learn from East Germany, with everyone informing on everyone else.//

But I thought that the former Eastern Block and Communist USSR were what the Labour Party aspired to?

[Khandro]

PP, Oh it goes back much further than that, were you never all kept in detention for some other brats misdeeds?

The Israelis used it quite effectively too, the parents of terrorists (whether they claimed knowledge or not) had their houses swiftly bulldozed.