Vote On 2Nd Refrendum

[spathiphyllum]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-mp-vote-second-referendum-theresa-may-no-deal-a8822636.html?fbclid=IwAR3EcMpn9zjPSS0Ma6kqi-73l4l-I6G-YAODbbImR1FFSo_myEtSkGJZ6TM


I'm genuinely bored of this now.

[ludwig]

I think it's going to be impossible to phrase the question for another referendum without the question itself influencing the result.

[mushroom25]

that's all very well, but what deal will the electorate be asked to give their consent for? doesn't the wording of the amendment imply the details of any deal need to be set out before the vote? or is the object of this to bypass parliament and attempt to get the public to foist the PM's deal on us?

[spathiphyllum]

I agree actually.

The vote should be:

- Forget anything ever happened
- Pursue a unrealistic ideology that our independence makes us stronger than being part of the EU.

[youngmafbog]

"- Forget anything ever happened "

You do realise we cannot go back to what we were?

The EU would have to agree to us staying and they would only do that by removing our rebate and making us adopt the Euro. Amongst other things.

[New Judge]

Bring it on, I say. Then the result of that can be simply ignored because our representatives could not run a whelk stall.

"The EU would have to agree to us staying and they would only do that by removing our rebate and making us adopt the Euro. Amongst other things"

There must be at least 16m (plus those who couldn't be bothered to get out of bed because, we are told, they were happy with the "status quo") who would be more than pleased to see more of their hard-earned shovelled over to Brussels/Strasbourg for distribution among the needy. They would also presumably be glad to see the back of Sterling and see the UK adopt a currency that has consigned millions of people across the continent to poverty.

[dannyk13]

The vote will not be whether to have a second referendum but rather a vote on extending Article 50.One of the motions does include that an extension would allow time to have a referendum but it looks like that will be voted down.

[New Judge]

So what's the extension for then and why should the EU allow it (other than to assist in scuppering Brexit entirely?)

[dannyk13]

NJ, at the moment they are debating how long an extension is required.If the house can agree on a some version of May's plan a short extension or, if not, a longer extension to allow time for another plan to be brought forward.

[naomi24]

I just heard on the radio that Mrs May will next week, for a third time, present her deal to Parliament. Since the EU has said there is no further room for negotiation, and No Deal has been taken off the table, the only reason an extension will be sought is for Mrs May to present her bill again and again until it's either accepted or everyone has completely abandoned the will to live and Brexit is ditched altogether. A second referendum won't solve it.

[spathiphyllum]

Maybe i'm pompous for even mentioning it.. But imagine if our idea of brexit, wasn't actually feasible.

[naomi24]

spath, //But imagine if our idea of brexit, wasn't actually feasible. //

'our'? Who?

[New Judge]

What do you mean? Within international law, sovereign nations can do as they wish.

[spathiphyllum]

'our' being the collective of society's perception of what brexit will be.

[naomi24]

spath, is there a 'collective perception'? I don't think so.

[dannyk13]

NJ ?

[Old_Geezer]

That's some imagination !

Meanwhile, back in reality... "a longer extension to allow time for another plan to be brought forward". What possible plan ? The EU has already made clear it's not shifting. If they ain't been reasonable so far in 2 years it ain't going to happen in a prolonged period of uncertainty. It can only be to try to get the UK to vote again and come up with the approved result. Like the EU always tries.

[dannyk13]

OG, Juncker has stated that the EU will be open to an extension to find a solution to this debacle.

[New Judge]

"...Juncker has stated that the EU will be open to an extension to find a solution to this debacle."

The only solution to this debacle (leaving with no deal) was effectively ruled out yesterday. Let's recap:

- There is only one "deal" on offer.
- Parliament has ruled that out on two occasions by massive majorities.
- Leaving with "No Deal" is not acceptable.

MPs have brought this situation on by refusing to sanction "No Deal". They cannot say they had no inkling a satisfactory deal would not be concluded. Anyone with half a brain should have realised it and in any case there were dire warnings before the referendum that (a) a satisfactory deal (i.e. one which achieved the stated aims of removing us from the Customs union, the Single Market and the ECJ) was unlikely and (b) "No Deal" would (allegedly) see the country go to Hell in a handcart.

Mr Cameron made no plans for a "Leave" vote and his successor made no significant plans from the outset for No Deal. Everybody had their heads in the sand. They've now looked up and don't like the look of what they have been missing.

[dannyk13]

Nj, It is still on the cards that May's, deal with a bit of tweaking, will be accepted next week.