Germany Will Plunge Into Recession If Uk Leaves The Eu Without A Deal.

[anotheoldgit]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7312717/Germany-plunge-recession-UK-leaves-EU-without-deal-business-leaders-warn.html

Well at least it will prove that they have just as much to loose as we do.

[jim360]

And it's still revisionist nonsense to talk as if the UK hadn't already tried precisely this. What do you think the "No Deal is better than a bad deal", "Brexit means Brexit", etc, was? It was the exact style that people have demanded -- and, at the time, it was taken completely seriously by all those who are now bemoaning the lack of that tough stance.

People seem determined to confuse negotiating style with negotiating substance. The UK can act as tough as it likes, but the simple fact remains that if Brexit goes A/T then the UK will take a larger hit than the EU. Boris Johnson is bluffing. The EU will call it. And we'll all look stupid once again.

[Zacs-Master]

Surely a German recession would make the country less attractive to 'illegals' (that is the correct AB parlance isn't it?) so a positive, surely?

[Old_Geezer]

If they call what they mistakenlythink is a bluff, they'll lose.
If Boris ever capitulated he'd be finished too. He's already pushing his luck with this 2 year suggestion.

[ToraToraTora]

jim: "And it's still revisionist nonsense to talk as if the UK hadn't already tried precisely this. What do you think the "No Deal is better than a bad deal", "Brexit means Brexit", etc, was? " - that's a twee statement by Mrs May, said early on which she completely negated by her actions shortly after. Boris has said we are prepared to leave with no deal as many times as he can at any opportunity, effectively nailing our colours to the mast, not comparable to Mrs May's Mewing at all. AH is bang on, up to now the EUSSR have known our hand and sat arms folded like a headmaster looking down on a petulant child. If the new stance does not force them to the table then we will leave with no deal, they can be sure of that now.

[Zacs-Master]

'If they call what they mistakenlythink is a bluff, they'll lose'

What's your reasoning behind that pearl of wisdom?

[Gromit]

// EU intransigence //

The EU have already agreed their side of a deal months ago.
It is the UK Parliament that is stopping that deal being being agreed.

[Old_Geezer]

Check the second sentence, then my previous posts. It all follows.

[Zacs-Master]

Sorry, not good enough. What are the mechanics behind the EU losing if they call our bluff?

[Old_Geezer]

Precisely, they decided on their demands then refused to budge. The UK is only stopping the anti-Brexit so called deal by refusingto accept the ridiculous. The EU is preventing the formulation of a reasonable agreement.

[Old_Geezer]

Perfectly good enough. Check the thread title.

[Zacs-Master]

'The EU is preventing the formulation of a reasonable agreement.'

Tosh. What about our own MP's refusing to back any 'deal'?

[andy-hughes]

jim - // The UK can act as tough as it likes, but the simple fact remains that if Brexit goes A/T then the UK will take a larger hit than the EU. //

Although everything said about Brexit is guesswork, an unarguable economic fact is that the EU exports around five times as much to us, as we do to them, so the notion of us taking a 'larger hit' than them seems difficult to balance.

[Khandro]

With or without a deal, the German economy is in dire straits; Deutsche Bank, Bayer, Volkswagen, Thyssenkrupp, Daimler Benz & many more are all planning & making big lay-offs.

Brexit is becoming the big universal excuse for bad management & lack of foresight.

[New Judge]

//Suddenly the battle plans are re-drawn. the EU can no longer sit across the table with its arms folded and a smug expression, it actually has to sit down and really negotiate with someone who appears to know what the word 'negotiate' actually means.//

Much as I admire your sentiments, Andy (and would love to agree with them) I fear you are mistaken. The EU still has only to sit on its hands (if they’re not busy moving the furniture between Brussels and Strasbourg, that is). There is no way on Earth that Parliament will allow us to leave by the current default of “No Deal”. Either: the deal will be re-hashed and agreed. (Likelihood out or 10, between nil and one - especially as Parliament has only a handful of working days before the end of October); or yet another pointless extension will be requested and probably agreed by the EU - and why wouldn’t they – they’re getting about £1bn a month from us. (Likelihood out of 10 between 10 and 11).

//I still am confused at the illogic behind "no deal to get a deal".//

I think that’s because you (and Parliament) haven’t grasped the basic tenets of negotiation, Jim. Our “backstop” is that we are leaving. We’d love to leave on sensible, mutually agreeable terms but if they cannot be agreed we’re leaving anyway. The alternative is what we’re enduring now – endless prevarication with no end game in sight. And that is beginning to prove more destructive than leaving with No Deal ever will. I think we’ve been through the “jumping off a cliff, shooting yourself as you go, having set fire to your house etc. etc.” analogy.

//The EU have already agreed their side of a deal months ago. //

It wasn’t a deal. It was a list of demands made under the threat of “we’ll make things very difficult for you otherwise”. Mrs May gave the Euromaniacs the impression it was a done-deal when she hadn’t even had the decency to inform her Cabinet of its details. Only when she locked them in Chequers and threatened to take their car keys away from them was any substance disclosed.

[ToraToraTora]

gromit: "The EU have already agreed their side of a deal months ago.
It is the UK Parliament that is stopping that deal being being agreed. " - yeah their side, totally unacceptable, I'd have thought even to a remainer.

[Zacs-Master]

Crikey, do we get a say?

[naomi24]

Oh dear.

[Old_Geezer]

"refusing to back any 'deal'"
You mean the remoaner MPs. Well you have a point, but come a decent deal there's no reason to believe they will continue to show themselves in a bad light. Not if they have any hopes of continuing their political career.

[Togo]

//Germany Will Plunge Into Recession If Uk Leaves The Eu Without A Deal.//

Shock horror...…...Good. They have been milking us for decades. Guess what happens to the Frogs when Germany is gasping for air...….They will drown.
Meanwhile in vibrant Britain..

""Boris Johnson’s government has unveiled plans for ten “free ports” around the country to boost jobs, trade, and innovation in Britain’s “left behind” coastal communities after Brexit.
Proposals to establish a series of free ports after Brexit first gained prominence when it was advanced by Rishi Sunak MP in the Centre for Policy Studies paper ‘The Free Ports Opportunity’ shortly after the EU referendum in 2016.
Mr Sunak has now been elevated to the position of Chief Secretary to the Treasury within the administration of the new Brexit-supporting prime minister, Boris Johnson, who has taken up the free ports agenda — with Secretary of State for International Trade Liz Truss carrying the banner for the policy at this stage.“Freeports [will] ensure Britain’s port cities and airports are ready to take full advantage of post-Brexit opportunities, including increased trade with the USA and fast-growing Asian markets as we sign our first free trade deals with global partners,” explained the Trade Department press release announcing the policy.
“There are already thousands of very successful free trading zones around the world, with the United States having pioneered the creation of over 250 free trade zones, employing 420,000 people, many in high-skilled manufacturing jobs,” the release notes.""

Why wasn't May doing something similar? You know the reason. Traitorous toady.

[retrocop]

Interesting post Togo. Thanks.