Good For You Ann, Why Should You Apologize, It Was The Name For A Very Popular Toy.

[anotheoldgit]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7780539/Brexit-Party-candidate-former-Tory-MP-Ann-Widdecombe-refuses-apologise-golliwog-WhatsApp.html

[Bobbisox1]

I like AW, love the way she rolls her eyes when she hears the Snowflakers go into overdrive , lol

[Cloverjo]

So how do we refer to the black doll with spiky hair that many people had and possibly still have?

[andy-hughes]

Mamay - // Are we never to refer to things that we now may view as archaic and outdated? //

As I pointed out in my post at 17:25, we should not confuse careful choices in use of language as being the same as censoring free speech.

Fifty years ago, in the southern states of the US, referring to a black person as a ***r was not only commonplace, it was likely not to arouse comment.

If you used that phrase in public now, and your defence was that 'people used to say it years ago .. ' how far do you think you would get?

[andy-hughes]

Cliverjo - // So how do we refer to the black doll with spiky hair that many people had and possibly still have? //

We refer to it as a golliwog, because that is what it is.

This is not about the word, it's about the time and place and context in which the word was used.

[andy-hughes]

Cloverjo - // That’s totally different, Andy. //

What is?

[Mamyalynne]

//This is not about the word, it's about the time and place and context in which the word was used.//

Correct - she was speaking of toys.

[Mozz71]

Given the context she used the word in, no apology is necessary. If she had used it in an insulting or derogatory way, that would've been a different kettle of fish.

It wasn't long ago when Robinsons still used the gollywog as a company logo.

[andy-hughes]

Mamya - // //This is not about the word, it's about the time and place and context in which the word was used.//

Correct - she was speaking of toys. //

Ms. Widdicombe was indeed speaking of toys.

The issue here, is that if you or I refer to a golliwog, very few people will notice, and fewer still will care.

As a politician at election time, someone like Ms. Widdicombe has a high profile, and everything she says and writes is going to be examined and commented on.

As a politician, she has a responsibility to reign in her urge for 'plain speaking', and realise that using a contentious expression is going to bring a negative response which, by association, may be extended to her party, because some voters will conclude that her views are that of the party of which she is a member.

You could argue that this is unfair, and I would agree with you - but this is the world we live in, and a little careful thought and a little less dismissal of disagreement would paint Ms. Widdicombe and her party in a better light, and today is a pretty important time to make sure that she does so.

[douglas9401]

Will no-one rid us of this turbulent journo?

[naomi24]

AH, //I think any regular here would know that I would never in my wildest dreams imagine that I speak for you!!! //

Good. That's that sorted.

[andy-hughes]

douglas - // Will no-one rid us of this turbulent journo? //

Unlikely!!

[douglas9401]

If not rid then, how about "reign" him in? :-)

[andy-hughes]

douglas - // If not rid then, how about "reign" him in? :-) //

Even less chance of that!!!

[Apc2604]

She should not apologise. It's the name of a toy. I used to collect the gollywog badges. (There I said it, and will continue to call it a gollywog because that is what they are) Or should we call in a Black rag dolll! Things have gone too far.

[Peter Pedant]

// Mamya - // //This is not about the word, it's about the time and place and context in which the word was used.//

who said that - this is AB and nothing is meant to make sense !

This is Frame Linguistics - study of words in the context in which they are made. go onto You tube and you will find a few lectures on it

I was going to say in The Alchemist - 1624 - one fella says - I gave her a fucus - which is a medication - but that still has a double meaning

oh - Elizabeth referring to Drake as a gay dog - had naughty undertones but certainly not a car park reveller looking for a hook-up

and fanny is front and back in American and English
The Donald would say: "doesnt matter a frack to me! I am not fussy!"
and Fanny is NEVER used as a Christian name in Amerikee
and so the intellectuals amongst you will wonder: what do the call Fanny Burney the daughter of the musicologist ( Charles Burney)(*) and authoress of many novellas - Evelina, Camilla, Cecilia ?
they dont - she is an english novelist not american

and finally led me drag this in somewhere:
"Read in light of Nazi caricatures of Jews as animals, or Hitler’s description of Untermenschen, the ‘sub-human’, Antonio’s casual abuse of Shylock as a ‘dog’ has sinister resonance."

[Peter Pedant]

(*) oops sozza
Chas Burney was the one who reported that the text of Allegri's Miserere was a secret of the Papal Chapel. ( Roy Goodman 1962 his perfect top D is said to flutter like a dove settling on a cross above a (erm christian) church ). ChaZZ reported that ze leedol Mozart (1770)heard it once and came out and transcribed it.

let's hear it for Chaz n Wolfie !

Yes reader you are right - I read these daily threads with their stolid put-downs and try instead to lighten your mood with breezy comments !

[EDDIE51]

You lot keep making the mistake of classing 'The Daily Wail' as a Newspaper !! It is a ' Scandel Sheet' nothing more !!! Do you realise it actually has a team of sub editors who's ONLY job is to ensure it is sufficiently offensive ?
MANY years ago it was a 'Real' Newspaper and highly respected !

[Peter Pedant]

you mean that article about the woman with 52 st breasts was untrue?

[Mamyalynne]

Please don't refer to fellow ABers as 'you lot'.


Eddie, are you saying Ann Widdecombe didn't say this?

If so - link please.

[JimF]

https://listverse.com/2007/12/03/top-10-politically-incorrect-kids-books/

I read all of these as a child and have never been to a cross burning.