Michael Leary - Racial Profiling

[Deskdiary]

Michael Leary has been accused of encouraging racism.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51596125

But he's right, isn't he?

When it comes to safety, what's wrong with profiling?

[Cloverjo]

I read the article in The Times in which he said that. I surprised myself by agreeing with a lot of what he said.

[ichkeria]

This has come up before.
It’s inconceivable that this doesn’t already happen.
But for various reasons it’s best done discreetly.

[andy-hughes]

Deskdiary - Would you, as a white man, consent to being profiled at an airport because a number of white men are rapists/murderers/thieves/sex abusers - delete as you wish?

[naomi24]

Yes, of course he's right.

[Mamyalynne]

Being totally non emotional about it, yes hr does make some sense, however if you strip it down to the finer detail then it would have to be all single men travelling alone surely?

I don't travel but I don't think your religious persuasion is on the Passport - is it?

Then - what about single women travelling alone?

[andy-hughes]

Mamya - I agree, dispassionately, being able to single out Muslim men on the basis that they may have links to terrorism sounds ideal.

But here in the real world, why should single Muslim men, or Muslim men in groups, or with families, be singled out purely on the basis of their faith?

If we look at the stats for rapists and murderers who are nominally Christian, shall we start doing the same profiling for them?

Like a lot of theories, it is impractical.

[mushroom25]

//If we look at the stats for rapists and murderers who are nominally Christian, shall we start doing the same profiling for them? //

errrr - why would you seek to profile for rapists and murderers at airports - does blowing up planes form part of a rapist's job description?

[andy-hughes]

mushroom - // //If we look at the stats for rapists and murderers who are nominally Christian, shall we start doing the same profiling for them? //

errrr - why would you seek to profile for rapists and murderers at airports - does blowing up planes form part of a rapist's job description? //

It was an example - if you want to start profiling criminals on the basis of their faith base, then you need to be absolutely sure that no white Christian has ever blown up a plane - and if they have, then profiling has to be done there as well.

Just to muddy the waters - Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, the 'underwear bomber' is Nigerian - maybe we'd better start looking at any man with a dark skin!

[mushroom25]

//if you want to start profiling criminals //

yeh I get that - but this isn't about criminal profiling per-se, but incident prevention; understanding the likelihood of an individual undertaking a destructive act in a high profile environment. and Ich is right, it does already go on (but I can't tell you how I know that).

[naomi24]

Mamyaynne and AH don’t seem to have grasped this at all.

Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab is indeed Nogerian. He is also Muslim … and Muslims come in all colours and nationalities. Colour isn’t the issue.

[pixie374]

If it is statistically right, then it makes sense... presumably it is not a hard and fast rule and suggesting it couldn't be anyone else, but going with likelihood first. I'm not sure it can be 'discrimination' if it is accurate.

[retrocop]

Just to muddy the waters - Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, the 'underwear bomber' is Nigerian.
With a name like that you will be telling us he is Jewish next.

A potential rapist is hardly going attempt a rape on a crowded aircraft.
A terrorist who attempts to blow up an aircraft is a murderer in any guise.

It's a coincidence that I was sent this by a legitimate gun owner this week.

//We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but, we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics.
Funny how that works.//

[andy-hughes]

mushroom - // /if you want to start profiling criminals //

yeh I get that - but this isn't about criminal profiling per-se, but incident prevention; understanding the likelihood of an individual undertaking a destructive act in a high profile environment. and Ich is right, it does already go on (but I can't tell you how I know that). //

If such profiling goes on, and it quite probably does, then it is best left out of the public consciousness, like so many other matters of our security that are dealt with entirely without us knowing anything about it.

The head of an airline saying it is a good idea is only ever going to end in trouble, he would be better keeping that particular thought to himself!

[andy-hughes]

naomi - // Mamyaynne and AH don’t seem to have grasped this at all. //

As the site's self-professed Muslin Expert, I can do without being patronised by you thankyou.

I am perfectly capable of grasping the concept, and I never ever need your condescending opinion.

[andy-hughes]

retrocop - // It's a coincidence that I was sent this by a legitimate gun owner this week.

//We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but, we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics.
Funny how that works.//

I am unsure what your point is - anyone with any common sense would not judge either Muslims or gun owners by the actions of deranged few.

I don't know where this 'encouragement' is coming from, perhaps your gun-owning friend can enlighten us on that.

[mushroom25]

//he would be better keeping that particular thought to himself! //
I expect the relevant authorities have already advised him of this.

//Muslin Expert //
wide thumb error - or an allusion to an afficianado of plain weave fabric? :-)

[pixie374]

Profiling has its uses when dealing with huge numbers of people. If I had to go out looking for a rapist or serial killer, I would focus first on males between 20-60 say. But I wouldn't rule out it being a 12 year old if the evidence suggested that.
It doesn't mean anything with just one individual, anything is possible, but when there are so many people, statistics can at least give a guide of where to start.

[naomi24]

//he would be better keeping that particular thought to himself!//

I disagree. I think profiling would make travellers feel more confident in reaching their destination safely.

[naomi24]

//As the site's self-professed Muslin Expert, I can do without being patronised by you thankyou.

I am perfectly capable of grasping the concept, and I never ever need your condescending opinion. //

Oops a daisy! I feel one of your 'moments' approaching, AH, and only a few posts into the thread too.

[Mamyalynne]

Mamyalynne does understand what he said and I have acknowledged there is some sound basis in his words - however how are the airports (in this instance) to identify "males of a Muslim persuasion" as he puts it?