Dr John Lee Writing In The Spectator On Coronavirus.

[Deskdiary]

Interesting article providing an alternative view.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/The-evidence-on-Covid-19-is-not-as-clear-as-we-think

I found the points he was making pretty compelling.

Thoughts?

[woofgang]

I haven't read the whole article but stopped at his first factual error...that people with serious illnesses who die have the death recorded soley as the result of the serious illness. I know from my own husband's death certificate, also from my mother in law's death certificate, that this is not true. Simple basic factual error.

[Theland]

Dr John Lee makes more sense than the alarmist government / science warnings and authoritarian policies that are taking away our freedoms.

[woofgang]

not if his arguments are based on factual errors

[Theland]

Wolf - With respect, your evidence is not comparable to Dr Lee, given his status, expertise and experience. In my opinion.

[Theland]

I am only guessing of course, but I imagine the article has not only been fact checked by Dr Lee and his peers, but also by the Spectator magazine itself.

[AuntPollyGrey]

The article is extremely thought provoking and reflects what I've been questioning over the past few days. How many people have already had the virus and not contacted any health professionals as they managed at home? Only those really sick are admitted to hospital and of these only a small percent are dying, usually because they have had underlying conditions. Statistics cannot be taken seriously if they are only taking into account those sick enough to warrant a test, or admittance to the ICU

[royfromaus]

I can't make sense of any of it.

[royfromaus]

Not the article, this whole coronavirus thing.

[Theland]

The new restrictive laws would be the envy of any tyrant.

[AuntPollyGrey]

I think on one hand we've over-reacted, then on the other I look at how quickly its taken hold in the USA. I'm beginning to think there may be more than one strain of this Virus.

[Deskdiary]

I think I prefer Dr Lee's thoughts to anecdotal from an AB member.

[Togo]

Jolly good link Deskdiary. I have just used some of the info from the article on a different thread without realising that you had posted this. I will show the participants on that other thread your op.

[NickorWan]

He writes ‘At the time of writing, the UK’s 422 deaths and 8,077 known cases give an apparent death rate of 5 per cent.’ That would only be true if you could say with some degree of certainty that all those within that total who hadn’t already died would recover. The reality is that all you could actually say from that information is that a death rate of 5 per cent would be the best outcome you could hope for.

I do agree that we don’t have enough information to trust any figures other than the numbers who have died, and perhaps many of them were critically ill at the time.

[Canary42]

He's a Consultant Pathologist using arguments based on Statistics which is NOT his speciality. I have grave doubts about the article.

[Gromit]

1500 deaths in the UK in the first 6 weeks.
Which is less than we would expect from regular flu.
So on those stats, the precautions appear to be overkill.
The difference is that no vaccine is available to stop the spread.
I hope the curtailment of our freedoms is a precaution worth making. Only time will tell if it was/is an over reaction. It would be a brave or very stupid (looking at Trump) leader who did nothing.

[woofgang]

my statement regarding what is written on death certificates is not anecdotal.

[AuntPollyGrey]

Woofgang, unless you are a doctor who frequently writes death certificates, then your story is anecdotal.

[Deskdiary]

It's anecdotal to everybody on AB..

[Peter Pedant]

// Dr John Lee makes more sense than the alarmist government / science warnings and authoritarian policies that are taking away our freedoms.// Theeley

erm hasnt all this been said before
I mean - - - prophesied
yup Book of Revelations
the bit about "and there will rise up false prophets"

yeah dis
24False messiahs and false prophets will arise, and they will perform signs and wonders so great as to deceive, if that were possible, even the elect.

maffew den

[Peter Pedant]

// my statement regarding what is written on death certificates is not anecdotal.//

um if he is saying - this thread is not clear for the main reason I havent waded froo all the answers -
that analysis of death certificates are a truly crap was of analysing causes of death because they are the subjective opinions of the persons certifying

then he is right

but that is not important right now is it? the hospitals are full of old people dying from a lung disease ( and NOT old muvva hubbards dementia ) - and that is unmistakeable if you go down to one

this is the oxford dept;s idea of "epidemic what epidemic?"

and is refuted by looking out of the window

solvitur visu ex fenestra baby

(it is solved by looking oudda a window - sozza reader - zeno's paradox on the impossibility of movement was - "solved by walking" - solvitur ambulando - oh videndo and not visu)

and what do you see if you do ( look out of the Yard? monty python this time) = dead bodies lots of dead bodies