Are We Destroying The Economy In Order To Prolong The Lives Of The Old And Frail?

[dave50]

Are we putting the livelihoods of millions of young people, some with children and mortgages at risk so some old lady in a care home can live a bit longer? Yes that is an extreme and some might say heartless example but basically that is what we are doing. When are politicians going to get a backbone and stand up and say that yes there may be more deaths as winter approaches but I'm afraid it's something we will have to live with, there is not much else we can do apart from what we are already doing. Another total lock down is out of the question and would be economic suicide. As I have often said, we can't save everybody and the sooner people accept that the better.

[teacake44]

13.49 ^^ You will I'm afraid because Naomi hobby is to always disagree.

[KARL]

Naomi, I agree that Iceland and the UK cannot be seen as equal/comparable - not because of the population differences but because one consistently outperforms the other on practically every socio-economic level. This is not a comfortable comparison for the UK so it is understandable that the inclination is to dismiss it (in the UK). Their solutions could and should have been thought of and applied first in the UK which had the Corona invasion ahead of Iceland.

Separately but connected: There are worrying signs of long term effects of Covid and they are not being given due exposure, except I recently saw somewhere that in Iceland they are setting up a record of cases and types. Chronic fatigue is already a noted concern there as are a number of other conditions months after the initial illness.

[naomi24]

Karl, //not because of the population differences but because one consistently outperforms the other on practically every socio-economic level..//

I think you’ll find that any ‘out-performance’ is predominately due to population differences.

Teacake, yet another logic failure for you there. Rather than attacking other posters try to stick to the question. You might do better.

[teacake44]

@18.00 It was you that educated me in the art of attacking other posters. Like I said its your hobby.

[woofgang]

KARL its being called Long Covid, I posted about it earlier in the thread. My colleagues who still work in the NHS know about it and are treating it as we speak.

[pixie374]

It's nothing to do with Iceland. Very different situations.
This is really a head versus heart decision and not easy.
Realistically, we know that everyone should have gone back to work a long time ago... and I know that. We had 3 weeks off, but otherwise continued.
However, my granddaughter started school this week... and I am concerned anyway. Whether I should be or not. I get both sides... but really, the only answer is for everyone to carry on as normal, while anyone worried or vulnerable, continues to shield. I think that's the current advice and about all we can do.

[pixie374]

Naomi, my family is Icelandic... having a female leader actually seems to be a huge bonus in dealing with this. There are different approaches.

[Peter Pedant]

// It's nothing to do with Iceland. Very different situations.//

I dont see if there is a difference in X or Y between the two countries, it is always gonna be associated with population - because Iceland is forever few and we are forever many. statistical quirk.

the only event distinguishable is if there is no difference in C between UK and iceland in which case you can conclude population doesnt play a part.

technical point - probably unsuitable for the braynes of AB

AND whilst you were discussing I accessed
https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3489

streamed webinar on Long Covid. It is long at 75 mins,
and can be summed up in 15s as
1.20% pts have debilitating signs at one month
2.and 2% of patients go onto 3 months
3.wait and see as there is very little else to be done
4. who will progress? usual suspects old hypertensive and diabetic.
and that is just about it

[teacake44]

^^ How long do I leave the above in the oven.?

[jno]

having a female leader actually seems to be a huge bonus in dealing with this

very true, pixie, I knew it was a mistake ditching Theresa May.

[Cloverjo]

Oh lord, can you imagine Theresa May dealing with this? I bet she goes to bed each night thanking her lucky stars.

[woofgang]

she'd have proper problems as she has type1 diabetes.

[KARL]

Fife has the exact same population size as Iceland, Fife cases 1000 (officially, possibly/probably a testing rate effect), deaths 200+ (Iceland 2150/10 much higher rate of testing). If equal to the whole of Scotland then proportionally at least half the Fife deaths occurred without access to full medical care, all 10 of Iceland's were in intensive care. Iceland has negative "excess deaths", Scotland/UK an as yet unclear but nevertheless significant excess. Within Scotland and in Fife itself the Fife figures/situation is/are considered "pretty good". I cannot reconcile the differences as a population size issue. To me it seems clear that something else is at play - as I said, it is broadly or even specifically a cultural thing. Broadly speaking, Fife is not hugely dissimilar to the rest of Scotland/UK whenever one looks at it objectively (not pretty). A lot of people have died unnecessarily, in Scotland/UK.