Capital Punishment, Yes or No?

[johnlambert]

The Americans have just carried out the 1000th execution since 1976, should we also bring back capital punisment for killers (all murderers, not just for killing a Police Officer)

Im going to stir up a hornets nest and say yes we should

[Gef]

Yes john you have stirred up a hornet's nest.

In my opinion the death penalty is not an option. Gary makes the point of the Guildford 4 and the Birmingham 6 all of whom might have been executed wrongly due to very dodgy police evidence.

I know that there are cases where the evidence is sound (Harold Shipman for example) but we have to have a law which covers everyone.

My own instinct is an eye for an eye etc but I can think of many cases where this would have been unjust.

Life imprisonment should mean just that.

[coyn]

I am in favour of capital punishment. I agree it doesn't work as a deterrant but how about it as a punishment? I think it should be used on a case by case basis and not just for all murderers or rapists etc. The likes of Ian Huntley, The Moors Murderers, Roy Whiting, Peter Sutcliffe, Rose West (I could go on)

You mean like the guildford 4, Birmingham 6, the bridgewater 4, maguire seven, and the other hundreds of innocent people that would have been murdered by the British establishment.

[bernardo]

No. It doesn't work as a deterrent, and it isn't a proper punishment. It's the esay way out, as Harold Shipman and Fred West decided. Apart from that, I don't want to lower myself to the moral level of killing someone.

[LazyGun]

No.

[LATECOMER]

Of course we should bring back hanging. If only to stop spending money to keep the vile people alive.If we had a referendum it would be brought back tomorrow. I would gladly do the job and sleep soundly afterwards. People should respect and fear the law.

[Oneeyedvic]

Just to add to this hornets nest - to the people who are for capital punishment:

1) What is murder - is abortion murder? How about euthanasia? What about a wife who has been beaten for years who has finally snapped? What about if you hit somebody in a fight, they fall over, crack their head and die as an ambulance is late in arriving?

2) Why only murder? Is murdering a husband after being beaten many times a worse crime than supplying drugs to children?

3) If we are to hang drug dealers who deal to children, should that include all illegal drugs? What sort of quantity of cannabis is dealing?

4) How about paedophiles? Should they be killed to? At what age does the victim have to be?

Would value any opinion on guidelines to give to judges / juries as to what constitutes a capital crime.

[eupraxia]

I listened to Gee Walker talk on the news about her sons killers. This is from the BBC site.

Anthony's mother Gee Walker said she accepted the sentence and hoped Taylor and Barton would use their time behind bars to "reflect on what they've done".

As quoted here the death penalty provides instant relief for those who have lost loved ones in some cases but what Gee Walker had to say is true. To kill these people does 3 things. 1) It's brings us down to thier level. 2) It does not work as we can see from the situation in the States. 3)As in the case of Williamson in the link provided Jake-the-peg, it gives time for the murder to reflect on what he has done. Why on earth should they be allowed the quick, simple and easy way out that death provides.

Fred West new what was coming if he lived. He got out. So did Harold Shipman and as Ian Brady and Ian Huntley want so much, they want to get away from the daily reminders of 4 walls that force them to think and go over day after day about what they did to end up where they are. In Williamsons case it has helped to stop others from ending up where he is and that can only be a good thing can't it. His death would not have made the slightest difference. Those people he killed are still dead and others would not have learned from his example and had second thoughts about where their lives were going.

Gee Walker also said in her speech that she had forgiven those who had taken her wonderful son. thats something I think is as brave as it gets. She said that it was in Gods hands now. No matter what you believe in that statement makes her way above those like her sons killers and will lead to her and Anthony being remebered and them being forgotten. So who wins. In my opinion she does and all that she stands for, what real humanity is all about.

[jno]

perhaps Loosehead you might be prepared to forgo capital punishment if you were sentenced to it yourself in spite of being innocent?

[Drisgirl]

Vic - late today - I agree with your usual reasoned response to such debates as I hope you are with mine.

I personally cannot add anything to what I have already said and it has been reiterated by like thinking,rational people.

Death is too good for those monsters let them rot and be at the mercy of the 'decent prisoners' - the one who would benefit from rehabilitation thus enabling lifers to serve life at no extra cost.

I 'know' people who have had the jail on a Saturday night until the Court on Monday morning and I guarantee they have NEVER re-offended.

[johnlambert]

Octaivus,

I have served for over 20 years in the British Army, and been involved in incidents where people have lost their lives (Northern Ireland,1st Gulf war, Bosnia) so yes I would serve as an executioner,

I would prefer the method used yesterday (lethal Injection).

Science today can almost rule out executing the wrong person. DNA is just so good these days that mistakes can be ruled out.

Also, how many murderers are released after a "life" sentance and killed again? When your dead your dead and cannot re offend

[Gef]

John that is just mince. DNA did not help the Guildford 4 or Birmingham 6 as it can only be used to prove guilt not innocence. How many released murderers do you know of that have reoffended?

[Oneeyedvic]

John Lambert -

How would DNA have helped Angela Canning? A double child murderer - later found innocent?

Also, would you like to reply to my earlier post?

[johnlambert]

Oneeyedvic

Each case MUST be judged impartialy and on its merits,

No to abotion, that is another hornets nest that I dont want to get involved in (religious reasons)

DNA was not availiable in the cases you mentioned

There are other means of punishing crimes againt children, if the perpitraitor doesnt kill then we could take away the urges using drugs, or, chemical castration (again we can look to the USA as they do this there)

[bernardo]

In answer to the people who say that executing someone (instead of keeping them in prison) would save money - in the USA it costs more to execute someone than to keep them in prison for life.

In answer to the people who say that DNA technology eliminates the chance of a wrongful conviction - ha ha ha! There are loads of murder cases where there is no DNA evidence. Miscarriages of justice happen for loads of reasons. There are also cases in which DNA has been mishandled, contaminated, misinterpreted etc.

[Drisgirl]

John - I think the antis are basically saying - correct me if I am wrong.

Life should mean life - simple as.

Well thats what I say - so that is fundamentally where the law has to be re-addressed.

[brionon]

Dolly, you say that it seems to work in Singapore.

Why then have they hung a man in the last few days? Because he wasn't deterred ?

[roguepink]

bernado - is right, it does cost more to execute someone than to keep them imprisioned for life, in the US. This, i believe, is due partly to the large amounts of money needed to pay for all the appeals and such which occur when someone is sentenced to die,

[loopyc]

yes if 100% sure that the person did the crime i think they should bring back capital punishment lots of killers are now released before their 30's and have a chance at life. why should they be intitled to life when they have taken somebody elses!!!

[Octavius]

Would not the judge, jury and executioner also be guilty of taking someone's life?