1/2 A Loaf ?

[Canary42]

Barmy Blair at it again - why can't he keep quiet now he's out of office. What's the point of embarking on a vaccination regime then abandoning it before completion.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55410349

[gingejbee]

The ones calling Blair "barmy" and "idiot" are obviously experts in the subject....aren't they?

[pastafreak]

How can there be full protection with one jab. The trials were based on 2...

// Pfizer has not tested their vaccine as a single dose so where have the numbers come from?

The large clinical trial using two jabs showed 52% protection in the time between the first and second jabs.

But it takes time for the immune system to fully respond, so that figure will include the time when there is no protection from the vaccine.

And this is true of the second jab; it's not an instantaneous response.

Data in the New England Journal of Medicine says there is 90.5% protection in the six days after the second jab.

Prof Salisbury's argument is this is all down to the first jab, as the second has not kicked in yet. //

Forgive my confusion...

[Sunk]

The vaccine does not give 100% protection.
The best it can do is 94% with 2 doses 21 days apart.
Just one dose gives 91% protection.

It seems a reasonable argument to give twice the amount of people 91% protection, instead of making them wait 6 months to just get an extra 3% more protection.

[bobbinwales]

Your figures may well be right sunk but is there alink to them as they seem odd to me. If there right the extra benefit of the second shot is so small it aint worth bothering with a second shot for most of us under 80, just maybe the most vunerable where death is a much common outcome so. That cant be right as the scientists and medical professionals and ministers would of not even considered the 2 doses for everyone given the urgentcy of the situation- its a huge error of judgment and a big waste a resources if your right.

[Sunk]

Bobbinwales,

From the OP link
// His proposal was backed up by Professor David Salisbury, the man in charge of immunisation at the Department of Health until 2013.
He told Today the numbers were "straightforward".
"You give one dose you get 91% [protection] you give two doses and you get 95% - you are only gaining 4% for giving the second dose," he said. //

[Paigntonian]

The way people talk about Blair you'd think no-one ever voted for him. They did and they were stupid.

[bobbinwales]

That summary of what Prof Salisbury said just doesnt seem right.
As pastafreak says it don't seem to fit with what were said in her copy and pasted text.
If things are as simple as Tony Blair and Prof Salisbury said then it will come out in the next few days and there would be lot's of red faces and resignations, heads should roll. My guess is that its nowhere near as clear cut as that or some one would of noticed and questioned the double dose stratagy before now. Surely.

[Hopkirk]

I wasn't aware that Tony Blair was an expert in immunology.

[bobbinwales]

whatever you think of the goverments truthfulness and the power teh scientists are wielding, the parlimentary committes including Jeremy Hunts health committee really grill ministers and someone like Hunt would love to embarras the current ministers so win the eveny (unlikly in my view) Blair has got the science right there will be no hiding place from Hunts commitee for Hancock and his PHE advisers

[Old_Geezer]

If it needs a booster to up the efficacy and yet you use your supply on the first shot and have none to use as booster, that is a waste of vaccine. One needs to let the scientists explain how to best use it. It's very fortunate there are do many willing beta test volunteers.

[Old_Geezer]

SO

[ichkeria]

"there would be lot's of red faces and resignations, heads should roll"

Well they wouldn't of course because ministers in this cabinet don't resign. We've have learned that by now.
However I think the general view is that it is too uncertain as to the protection of the first jab alone to be able to risk it.

[bednobs]

for all those that blasted the idea - (or the messenger maybe?)
this is what they are going to be doing with the new vaccine - as many people as possible to get one dose as fast as possibe

[jno]

I don't think I've seen the 90% efficacy figure before. Is it new?

If it's really true that a second dose adds only another 4% protection, then there's something to be said for the notion of doing most people first. But previous reports have given a much lower figure for the first dose.

[woofgang]

the gap between vaccinations is now allowed to be longer but its still emphasised that 2 doses are needed.

[Souldarkness]

One dose give protection after the body mobilised defences. The second dose not only slightly increases the efficacy it increases the duration of protection. It's how vaccines for hepatitis B work. It's given in stages, so you reinforce the effects