I'm Really Worried I Have Upset My...
Family & Relationships1 min ago
Barristers
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According to the Beeb junior barristers earn an average of £12,400 a year, a figure I find very hard to believe. Newsnight also says that the government has offered a pay rise of 15 per cent which would 'add £7,000 a year' to their annual salaries. Many on this site will be better mathematicians than I but I can't work those figures out.
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From the Government, "The Independent Review of Criminal Legal Aid found that, before expenses, the median fee of a criminal barrister in 2019-20 was £79,800 and that 80 percent earn at least £45,000 after expenses. While junior barristers earn much less in their first couple of years of practice, by their third year of practice the average criminal barrister will earn £65,000 before expenses."
Using the nett earnings that 80% receive-£45,000-15% of that is £6,750 or £7,000 rounded up.
Using the nett earnings that 80% receive-£45,000-15% of that is £6,750 or £7,000 rounded up.
Regarding the sums in your post:
If 15% = £7000, divide by 15 to get 1% and then multiply by 100 to get 100%. That yields a figure of £46,700 (to the nearest hundred pounds) as the current annual salary used in those calculations.
A key bit from TCL's quote is the "before expenses" bit. Barristers have to pay fees to their chambers. Further, many barristers live in or around London (because that's where their chambers are based) but have to travel to Crown Courts across the country. So, for example, a barrister representing a client in Norwich Crown Court will have to pay a peak-time return rail fare to get there before 10am, whereas a barrister who has to go to Newcastle Crown Court will need to pay the costs of a return rail fare and a night's accommodation. So barristers' expenses can add up very quickly.
The median figure for a barrister's pay two years after being called to the Bar is just £18,800 after their expenses have been deducted. That mean's that a half of all barristers with that length of service are earning LESS than £18,800. (Source: https:/
That's after three years at university (where exceptional A-level grades are required to get onto a Law course in the first place), another year of study for the Bar Professional Training Course, a year of pupillage in chambers and then those first two years of service.
If 15% = £7000, divide by 15 to get 1% and then multiply by 100 to get 100%. That yields a figure of £46,700 (to the nearest hundred pounds) as the current annual salary used in those calculations.
A key bit from TCL's quote is the "before expenses" bit. Barristers have to pay fees to their chambers. Further, many barristers live in or around London (because that's where their chambers are based) but have to travel to Crown Courts across the country. So, for example, a barrister representing a client in Norwich Crown Court will have to pay a peak-time return rail fare to get there before 10am, whereas a barrister who has to go to Newcastle Crown Court will need to pay the costs of a return rail fare and a night's accommodation. So barristers' expenses can add up very quickly.
The median figure for a barrister's pay two years after being called to the Bar is just £18,800 after their expenses have been deducted. That mean's that a half of all barristers with that length of service are earning LESS than £18,800. (Source: https:/
That's after three years at university (where exceptional A-level grades are required to get onto a Law course in the first place), another year of study for the Bar Professional Training Course, a year of pupillage in chambers and then those first two years of service.
I found this,
'Michelle Heeley, a criminal barrister, told BBC's Five Live the justice system was "crumbling" because of a lack of increase in pay.
Responding to comments that criminal lawyers were perceived to be well paid, she admitted those high up the pay scale were "very fortunate". But she said the median pay for a junior barrister was £12,700 per year.'
https:/
'Michelle Heeley, a criminal barrister, told BBC's Five Live the justice system was "crumbling" because of a lack of increase in pay.
Responding to comments that criminal lawyers were perceived to be well paid, she admitted those high up the pay scale were "very fortunate". But she said the median pay for a junior barrister was £12,700 per year.'
https:/
Also found this,
'Jo Sidhu QC, chair of the Criminal Bar Association, said the action is not merely about pay but “redressing the shortfall in the supply of criminal barristers to help deal with the crisis in our courts”.
He said: “We have already suffered an average decrease in our real earnings of 28 per cent since 2006, and juniors in their first three years of practice earn a median income of only £12,200, which is below minimum wage.”'
https:/
'Jo Sidhu QC, chair of the Criminal Bar Association, said the action is not merely about pay but “redressing the shortfall in the supply of criminal barristers to help deal with the crisis in our courts”.
He said: “We have already suffered an average decrease in our real earnings of 28 per cent since 2006, and juniors in their first three years of practice earn a median income of only £12,200, which is below minimum wage.”'
https:/
There are huge numbers every year getting Law degrees (of which I was one in 1970) and then
LPC - law practice course ( where "you learn the proper law") and then you had to find pupillage
I think even then it was 3000 grads chasing 300 pupil places
and rest become tesco check out cashiers
it is a hard life indeed and harder now
so who made it: well Allan Gore QC Judge on the Northern circuit
Roy Bean now a law lord of appeal in Ordinary - comes wivva sir, just like his Dad!
Peregrine Simon (sir) Master of the Rolls, - er wasnt Lord John Simon an appeal judge - that was his Dad - and his grandad - Lord Chancellor ( or not) - Jocelyn that is. Judge Wright son of er Judge Wright....
it indeed a hard road, readers to riches
LPC - law practice course ( where "you learn the proper law") and then you had to find pupillage
I think even then it was 3000 grads chasing 300 pupil places
and rest become tesco check out cashiers
it is a hard life indeed and harder now
so who made it: well Allan Gore QC Judge on the Northern circuit
Roy Bean now a law lord of appeal in Ordinary - comes wivva sir, just like his Dad!
Peregrine Simon (sir) Master of the Rolls, - er wasnt Lord John Simon an appeal judge - that was his Dad - and his grandad - Lord Chancellor ( or not) - Jocelyn that is. Judge Wright son of er Judge Wright....
it indeed a hard road, readers to riches
well what about George Carman QC ? now dead
He was the one who got Doddy of Knotty Ash off the tax fraud charge ( but there was still the unpaid tax)
he was the one who used to tell witnesses - goaway and come back on the 3rd day of the trial....Gillian Taylforth ( no reader she didnt appear on Day 3, she was the plaintiff, and was defeated by the sudden witness).
It had ( 'it' is the case) to go to trial because he needed the moolah which he was gambling away
when he went back to wifey and said I have inoperable advanced ca prostate. SHE said " you have taken everything." True: he had gambled the house away
(note he is dead, in case anyone goes ' foo libel dat.foo I will tell Miss')
He was the one who got Doddy of Knotty Ash off the tax fraud charge ( but there was still the unpaid tax)
he was the one who used to tell witnesses - goaway and come back on the 3rd day of the trial....Gillian Taylforth ( no reader she didnt appear on Day 3, she was the plaintiff, and was defeated by the sudden witness).
It had ( 'it' is the case) to go to trial because he needed the moolah which he was gambling away
when he went back to wifey and said I have inoperable advanced ca prostate. SHE said " you have taken everything." True: he had gambled the house away
(note he is dead, in case anyone goes ' foo libel dat.foo I will tell Miss')
Judge Roy Bean has come far since he was the only law west of the Pecos
https:/
in Texas then, in Ordinary now.
https:/
in Texas then, in Ordinary now.
This action is by the criminal bar. Not all barristers are on strike.
The criminal bar is largely funded by legal aid. Legal aid rates are set by the government. Not only are the fees fixed and very low, it can often be years before they are actually paid, since they are not paid until the case is over. Many are leaving the criminal bar and fewer are attempting to join because of the terrible conditions (and I do not just mean the pay). That's fewer people to do the work. The knock-on of this is that cases are having to be adjourned due to lack of lawyers (prosecuting and defence). In the past, barristers would do "returns". These are cases that the Court has listed but the trial advocate is unavailable. The barrister who covers returns very often receives a last minute brief - probably the evening before (and often a case not seen before) and has to get on top of several files of papers very quickly to then cover the hearing. To "read in" to a case can take hours (and I do mean hours) to then attend Court for a hearing for which the fixed fee can be less than £100. Whilst the hearing might be listed for 10am, that barrister could be there all day waiting for the case to be called on or waiting for his or her opponent to be released from another courtroom. Out of that fee, he has to pay the expenses of attending Court plus a fee to his clerks (normally a %), plus the ongoing fees of staying in practice (insurance, Practising Certificate fee, CPD, essential books etc). It doesn't take a maths professor to work out that this is unsustainable.
In 2018 (I think it was), the Criminal Bar proposed escalation of action but agreed to postpone pending an independent report. That independent report concluded that investment was needed in the Criminal Justice system, but the government ignored it.
And I will undoubtedly hear protests from those who say "so what, they are guilty scum anyway". However, this does not just involve defence lawyers, but also prosecution lawyers (since the CPS are underfunded and understaffed, they have to brief out to the independent bar). So that impacts the victims of crime as well as the falsely accused.
And Junior barristers are still very much barristers - despite what is claimed above.
The criminal bar is largely funded by legal aid. Legal aid rates are set by the government. Not only are the fees fixed and very low, it can often be years before they are actually paid, since they are not paid until the case is over. Many are leaving the criminal bar and fewer are attempting to join because of the terrible conditions (and I do not just mean the pay). That's fewer people to do the work. The knock-on of this is that cases are having to be adjourned due to lack of lawyers (prosecuting and defence). In the past, barristers would do "returns". These are cases that the Court has listed but the trial advocate is unavailable. The barrister who covers returns very often receives a last minute brief - probably the evening before (and often a case not seen before) and has to get on top of several files of papers very quickly to then cover the hearing. To "read in" to a case can take hours (and I do mean hours) to then attend Court for a hearing for which the fixed fee can be less than £100. Whilst the hearing might be listed for 10am, that barrister could be there all day waiting for the case to be called on or waiting for his or her opponent to be released from another courtroom. Out of that fee, he has to pay the expenses of attending Court plus a fee to his clerks (normally a %), plus the ongoing fees of staying in practice (insurance, Practising Certificate fee, CPD, essential books etc). It doesn't take a maths professor to work out that this is unsustainable.
In 2018 (I think it was), the Criminal Bar proposed escalation of action but agreed to postpone pending an independent report. That independent report concluded that investment was needed in the Criminal Justice system, but the government ignored it.
And I will undoubtedly hear protests from those who say "so what, they are guilty scum anyway". However, this does not just involve defence lawyers, but also prosecution lawyers (since the CPS are underfunded and understaffed, they have to brief out to the independent bar). So that impacts the victims of crime as well as the falsely accused.
And Junior barristers are still very much barristers - despite what is claimed above.
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