Sir Patrick Vallance’s Evidence

[sp1814]

Do you believe that Johnson had a firm handle on the science he was presented with?

https://x.com/haggis_uk/status/1726580352859484410?s=46&t=ut4EGtcg_YdDrd5ue_if3w
 

...or not?

[Ellipsis]

> Do you believe that Johnson had a firm handle on the science he was presented with?

A firm handle on the science? I think not ...

https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnson-bamboozled-by-covid-science-claims-sir-patrick-vallance-13012223

Sir Patrick again stood by his entry when questioned by the inquiry's legal team, pointing to how Mr Johnson dropped science as a subject aged 15, adding: "He did struggle with some of the concepts and we did need to repeat them often."

[Ellipsis]

Also yesterday, on a different channel ... I'm a Celeb!

https://www.thesun.co.uk/tv/24798151/im-a-celeb-nigel-farage-slams-boris-johnson/

This Morning host Josie Gibson asked Farage what Johnson was like, saying: “What’s he like on a personal level?”

EastEnders star Danielle Harold added: “Forget politics, as a guy.” 

Farage replied: “Entertaining… in small doses. [He’s] surprisingly introverted.

"You see this big act, fluffing the hair… surprising.” 

Gibson then asked: “Is he quite a fumbler in real life, or is that just on the stage?”

Farage the slammed: “I think he’s one of the most disorganised human beings that possibly ever lived.

"The whole thing’s bloody chaos. Shambles.” 

[Peter Pedant]

I watched all morning and it was quite measured. First three months everyone agreed of the diary was a 'look back' so he obviously kept it as a contemporaneous record

yes - no - the point of a scientific committee is to advise on sicence but not on how it  is done as that is legal / political. I am not sure if BoJo had to understand as he had to lead

and THAT was the chaoric part - he shilly - shallied.

I have been on a committee where someone said oo I think our leaders wont like  that ( they werent meant to)

and on another where someone said - right or wrong, this is the wrong committee

both led predictably to disaster

[Peter Pedant]

and I have also been  asked by the  Great Man - any problems and it was strongly pointed out after - the answer was no

what even if there are? yup - I lie to the  Great Man ? yup

I didnt last long

[Deskdiary]

Why would Johnson need a firm handle on the science? Isn't that what the two doom-goblins were for?

[THECORBYLOON]

"Why would Johnson need a firm handle on the science?"

 

He would have needed to understand the arguments so that he could explain his rationale for making the decisions he arrived at.

[Peter Pedant]

" we are fallowing the science n this" BoJo

and they werent, and vallance was ..... keeping notes

[Deskdiary]

Understanding the arguments is different to understanding the science. I'm pretty sure I could do the former, I'm even more sure I wouldn't be able to do the latter in any great depth.

[youngmafbog]

What science?

[bhg481]

Peter, are you actually saying that Boris was lying? That pillar of society and leader of the country telling lies? I think there are some people on here who might challenge you on that (but I won't be one of them).

[sp1814]

youngmafbog

 

The maths.

Maths is a science.

Grasping the concepts of different types of tests.

if the government "got the big calls right" (as some still believe), then surely it was DESPITE having  Johnson as PM not BECAUSE we had him?

[bednobs]

i too wonder how people expect a politician to have a firm handle on the science.  it's like me suddenly being expected to!

[THECORBYLOON]

"Understanding the arguments is different to understanding the science."

Were the arguments not partly based on the science? 

If the argument is for or against lockdown, it would be helpful to know how reliable the scientific evidence is, what it is based upon and the likely outcomes.

[sp1814]

Bednobs

 

when that politician is running the country and is presented with arguments for and against a critical matter of policy, he need to understand what's being presented.

 

He certainly dies by need to be an expert - but it helps if he understands broad concepts (such as absolute and relative risk).

 

The CEO of Shell doesn't have to know exactly how to frack a gas deposit, but he or she certainly should know what the broad impact of fracking may have on a community.

[bednobs]

but i wouldnt call that "a firm handle"

[Peter Pedant]

The CEO of Shell doesn't have to know  ......... on a community.

I think he probably does actually

Not knowing a damn thing about what you are managing is more charcteristic of Fransh "Dirigisme" - 20 y ago the head of the French Bank ( Bonk de France probably) - said "my greatest advantage is that I dont know how to run a bank" - oo-er madame!  - oo-la-la Madame

and it wasnt Christine Lagarde. He ( they are all) a grad of ENA ( ay-naaah) and was an enarque ( geddit) which was the grande ecole to train admin ( hautes fonctionnaires)

god this has turned into a really heavy post about Frech central admin... sozza reader

[Peter Pedant]

and enarques regualrly chop and change industries as part of their wide training.

founded 1945 ( de Gaullle) and Macron said he wd scrap it, and then later said, he wouldnt

[Ellipsis]

It was shambolic. He shouldn't know whether he was wiffing or waffing.

The signs were there a long time ago. For example this from 2019, before he was PM - the state of his car ...

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9317278/boris-johnsons-messy-car-cups-rubbish/

An utter shambles.

[Deskdiary]

^^^That is some heavy duty crowbarring going on there.

[Ellipsis]

You think Boris wasn't a shambles?